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Bill: State & Religion
Details
Submitted by[?]: Marxist Party of Darnussia
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: November 2111
Description[?]:
| Religion as Opium of the People! |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The state's intervention in the appointment of ministers of religion.
Old value:: The state does not intervene in the appointment of ministers of any religion whatsoever.
Current: The state does not intervene in the appointment of ministers of any religion whatsoever.
Proposed: The state has the right to veto the appointment of any ministers of religion.
Article 2
Proposal[?] to change Remuneration of ministers of religion.
Old value:: The state does not intervene in the remuneration of ministers of religion.
Current: The state does not intervene in the remuneration of ministers of religion.
Proposed: The salaries and pensions of ministers of religion shall be borne by the state and regulated by the law.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 21:29:42, September 14, 2005 CET | From | Marxist Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | Now debate really! If you do not like something tell and debate, we can find a compromise... |
| Date | 21:56:46, September 14, 2005 CET | From | Social Democratic Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | Just leave it to the church, government should not do anything at all to interfer. |
| Date | 22:00:04, September 14, 2005 CET | From | Chinkopodian Economic Democrats | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | I am in agreement with SDP. |
| Date | 22:25:22, September 14, 2005 CET | From | Libertarian party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | They should at least get food and shelter etc... and you cant leave that up to the church... thats just hoping they'll get many visitors. And when they do they'll be far richer then well... about everybody... But leaving it to the local government means the local government can decide what they do with them so they can let them rot away... and off course we should also make sure no strange radicals are becoming minister of religion... |
| Date | 05:08:37, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Social Libertarian party | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | If they want to join a strange church that fucks them over, their choice. Also, if you're anti-religion you'd be against this bill and that is a misquote, Marx made the reference much more subtle. |
| Date | 09:14:39, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Marxist Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | I defend my position. Local governaments are more close to people than central governament. If local governament choose there is more democracy. People can controll better these decisions. So ministers of religion must be democratic elected by people. In the town people debate and determine their connection with churcs. But Churc can be do whatsoever other thing. Local governament do not interfere in worship. About remuneration, people must decide how much ministers of religion are paid. It something unfair that a worker gain lesser than a bishop. |
| Date | 09:36:27, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Marxist Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | However i modify second proposal. Starting vote now... |
| Date | 12:23:29, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Libertarian party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | SLP: if that comment was to me Marx's quote means religion will fade away when all problem disapear, the people use opium to get out of everyday trouble. And therefore it'll disapear when these problems dissapear, this is proven in the western world with the exception of the every strange U.S.A.. There are off course more radical communists against religion (which i'm no part of) Lenin said: Religion is the opium TO the masses and Mao said: Religion is poison. Although i agree with both a little i do not think religion should be severely oppresed. |
| Date | 12:24:04, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Libertarian party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | I only agree with the second btw but the 1st is a step closer to my ideas. |
| Date | 13:14:57, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Marxist Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | Ok, but this bill do not abolish religion in any way. This bill take care only of social aspect: pensions and offices. |
| Date | 18:18:12, September 15, 2005 CET | From | Social Democratic Party of Darnussia | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | I prefer no government interference in the church, it only leads to trouble |
| Date | 00:17:03, September 16, 2005 CET | From | Social Libertarian party | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | for real, slippery slope much? |
| Date | 00:17:15, September 16, 2005 CET | From | Progressive Democratic Alliance | To | Debating the State & Religion |
| Message | HELL NO!!! LONG LIVE SECULARISM!!! NO STATE RELIGION! |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||||
| yes | Total Seats: 15 | ||||||
| no |
Total Seats: 185 | ||||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: Voters have an extra appreciation for bills that actually get passed, so if you want to maximally take profit from your votes, make sure you compromise with others. |
| Random quote: "Religion, like capitalism, will perish in the end. We estimate the complete Terra-wide extinction of Hosianism as a religious belief by the year 4409, and in Dorvik by 4398." - Friedrich Pfeiffer, former Dorvish politician |