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Bill: Government Reform Bill of 2563
Details
Submitted by[?]: Federal Republican Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This bill asks for an amendement to the Constitution. It will require two-thirds of the legislature to vote in favor. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: October 2563
Description[?]:
| To facilitate in fixing a broken government. Fair representation is the only moral decision here. Many of our fellow legislators have wafted on this decision before and given it consideration. I believe it is time to revisit this measure. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The method used to determine the number of seats each region receives in the national legislature.
Old value:: A proportional algorithm that gives a very small advantage to larger regions.
Current: A proportional algorithm that gives a very small advantage to larger regions.
Proposed: Equal representation, regardless of region population.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 15:41:42, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Solentian People Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | Can I make a point or two on this- This bill often looks like you are giving an advantage to everyone and being free and fair but in Solentia different regions have different sizes and therefore the bigger regions should get an advantage as more Senators are needed in these areas to cope with more people. It is proportionally fair to keep things the way they are as bigger regions get more representations and more senators which is correct because there are more people. This is the way it should be, if you want Proportional Representation- you will vote NO on this bill. |
| Date | 16:06:37, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Federal Republican Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | To the People Party, On your own parties platform page it says the following: "The People Party has also fought racism when the Radicalists were in power and supported democracy and Proportional representation when others opposed it." Now you find yourself on quite the opposite side of this it appears. I know you've supported it in the passed as well. Proportional representation is at best an issue with nomenclature. Do you believe to the votes of those in Orame are more important than in Nukeya? Apparently so. Party Spokesman, Ron Seigler |
| Date | 16:28:13, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Solentian People Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | I don't believe they're more important, but I believe that Nukeya as a bigger region for example should elect more representatives than Orame because it is a bigger region and because there are more people who need representing. I could equally fire the same question back at you which would be- Do you think the votes in Nukeya are more important than Orame? Apparently so. The point I am trying to make is that I am fighting for PR because I am voting for more representatives for bigger regions because there are more people to represent- that is proportional. Your way is to make every single region exactly the same regardless of proportion which is absurd. For example, Orame say may have 3 Million resident and Nukeya may have 10 Million residents- you are voting for both these regions to have exactly the same amount of senators. Say for example, I won 3 seats in each of My Nukeya senators would represents a few hundred thousand, whilst my Orame senators would represent a 5 figured number, some representatives would have bigger consituncies making your way totally unfair, unequal, unconsiderate of our conditions and non proportional. |
| Date | 19:49:58, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Federal Republican Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | I understand the People Parties whimsical meanderings and attempts at justifications though, by their own words they've snared themselves up better than I could have. You say, "I believe that Nukeya as a bigger region for example should elect more representatives than Orame." Later however your tune changes to E-Flat with, "Your way is to make every single region exactly the same regardless of proportion which is absurd." Ladies and Gentlemen, do you not see the blunderbuss of a hole in those two statements? Oh but, I wish that was all! The People Party proclaims, "I don't believe they're more important..." This leads to "I believe that Nukeya as a bigger region for example should elect more representatives than Orame because it is a bigger region." Well, if this is what you want-it isn't the way the system is. Orame gets more seats in the Senate than any other region; feel free to fact-check me here-I'm right. If you want free and fair and equally-proportional outcomes as any free democratic republic ought to; then you'd stop with your double-speak and support this measure or propose another to show you really do care. You've supported it in the past, now you don't. Your justifications fly like a flag in the wind and you can't articulate your own views! If the People Party would like to throw mud, I'd ask he actually picks up the mud first. |
| Date | 19:50:28, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Federal Republican Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | OOC: Sorry, that was IC-forgot to sign it as the Party Spokesman, Ron Seigler for clarification! |
| Date | 20:25:44, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Solentian People Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | FRP- This is nonsense, utter nonsense as usual- thank goodness your no longer our president and will be kissing bye bye to cabinet roles shortly as well (Cheers) Anyways, back to this argument- it is quite simple. Every region is different in size and therefore should have different amounts of senators so every senator represents (roughly), the same amount of people for equal, fair and proportional representation. If the FRP doesn't understand this, more fool them because different regions are different sizes and under your proposal it would see the same amount of senators up for election in all regions despite some being larger than others, how is that fair explain that to me? |
| Date | 20:46:18, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Federal Republican Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | OOC: I agree with the F.I.P. on the main-page, I've said and the S.R.N.P. has said it. We all need to be more careful of OOC feelings coming in-game. Frankly, your blurb initially up there is insulting, baseless and petty above all else. I know you have contempt for the F.R.P. and that is absolutely fine. Though, in our PM's to one another you nor I resort to the type of nonsense you've just put on parade. Please Sir, refrain. IC: The Federal Republican League has no further comments on the issue at hand. We thank the supporters of this measure and those even of the Heritage Coalition who recognize that equal proportional representation is not only sensible but, creates a better society where all citizens of every state are equal in the affairs of representation in the Senate. Signed, Party Spokesman, Ron Seigler |
| Date | 21:49:33, April 18, 2008 CET | From | Solentian People Party | To | Debating the Government Reform Bill of 2563 |
| Message | The FRP are not answering my question -"different regions are different sizes and under your proposal it would see the same amount of senators up for election in all regions despite some being larger than others, how is that fair explain that to me?" Perhaps, they have no further comments because they know that they are wrong with this debate and know perhaps their actions are unfair towards PR. Martha Wheatdale, PP Leader/Whip OOC: I will respond to your OOC comments on PM. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 144 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 281 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: When you join the game, you will find yourself with only zero seats. That's because your party's representatives haven't been elected yet. You need to establish your party's position on issues by proposing several bills that your party wants passed and sending them to vote. This raises your visibility and if you do it enough, you will win seats at the next election. |
| Random quote: "If you cannot convince a fascist, acquaint his head with the pavement." - Leon Trotsky |