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Bill: Identity Card Policy Reform
Details
Submitted by[?]: Kanjoran People's Party
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: May 2115
Description[?]:
| We do not feel forcing people to have identity cards with them at all times is reflective of a free country. This reminds us more of fascism of Nazi's towards Jews before and during Holocaust and the South African govt during segregation and South (US) during slavery. We could be willing to compromise on this with "All citizens are issued with identity cards but are not required to carry them." if reason dictates it. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change Government-issued identity card policy.
Old value:: All citizens are issued with identity cards and are required to carry them at all times.
Current: All citizens are issued with identity cards but are not required to carry them.
Proposed: All citizens are issued with identity cards but are not required to carry them.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 02:32:24, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | We do not feel forcing people to have identity cards with them at all times is reflective of a free country. This reminds us more of fascism of Nazi's towards Jews before and during Holocaust and the South African govt during segregation and South (US) during slavery. |
| Date | 02:53:29, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Populist Liberal Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | Well, issuing them mandatorily but not requiring carrying them would make no sense. We should definitely go one way or the other. The PLP is still caucusing on which way to come down on this issue. We don't think it's so clearly incompatible with a free society. They may be used in totalitarian societies because it makes their police's jobs easier. However, we also want to make the jobs of Kanjoran police easier, to enforce our non-totalitarian laws. So we have yet to decide a position on the issue. |
| Date | 03:22:40, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | It's not really insensible. In America the government issues ID's but only on request, and you are not required to carry them. They also issue Driver's Licences but you only need it for driving; although, it doubles as an ID. America doesnt have a problem with voluntary ID cards and continueing to enforce the law. The government can still have a citizenry database of sorts without mandatory ID's. |
| Date | 04:50:08, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Populist Liberal Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | We suppose you're right about the lack of need, given that we do fine in the USA without mandatory ID's. So, therefore, unless someone or something changes the PLP's mind, we will vote in favor. |
| Date | 05:04:13, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran Imperial Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | We disapprove. I don't understand why this reminds you of the Confederacy, Nazi germany, or the Apartide (however it's spelled). Sure, mandatory identification was required in the latter 2, but the purposes were completely different than ours. It's like comparing apples and oranges. The Nazis wanted to (a. keep track of their holocaust killjng system, and b). make sure that during the time of war, everyone could be accounted for and exploited for the war machine. We only want to have an easy way to verify a person's identity so that they cannot lie about who they are. There are many other practical purposes which i cannot think of now. |
| Date | 11:59:21, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Secular Humanist Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | I would prefere to issue them (for beaurocracy reasons) but without requiring people to carry them around |
| Date | 13:47:06, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | The Confederacy had blacks carry around their "papers" to show they were free or enslaved. If they were caught without them (even if they were free) they were sold to plantations or if a slaveholder was quick enough he could claim him as a runaway slave. Who would agree with mandatory distribution with optional carrying? |
| Date | 13:49:06, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | This is is a trivial alteration if you ask me. Making sure everyone has a source of ID would be beneficial for them anyway. It's the forced carrying around of the IDs that I think goes to far. |
| Date | 23:36:19, September 22, 2005 CET | From | Populist Liberal Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | This is a close enough issue for us that we conducted internal polling of our supporters, and our internal polling shows that those who liked our party in the last election would tend to prefer a vote in favor of this change. We rarely "govern by polls," but in this case we will listen to our constituents as there are good arguments on either side. We would add, however, that the fact that many despicable governments have used mandatory ID cards is not a solid argument agaisnt them. Since Volkswagens were created in Nazi Germany at the behest of the Nazis, it doesn't mean that we should ban Volkswagens. The reason we find this a difficult issue is that we know most real life countries lack mandatory ID's and do just fine, and it would be a major pain to have to feel the force of law state that there was something one would better always carry with him. |
| Date | 01:17:14, September 23, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | You're right. I was using one if not several fallacies by associating the practice with nazi's, slaveowner, and segregationists. Sorry for that. It did truly remind me of them but it's not a logical reason to reject something. |
| Date | 01:17:39, September 23, 2005 CET | From | Kanjoran People's Party | To | Debating the Identity Card Policy Reform |
| Message | I also had practical reasons so its not all bad. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 251 | ||||
| no | Total Seats: 189 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
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