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Bill: Make prisoners suffer greatly.
Details
Submitted by[?]: East Trigunia Company
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: November 2587
Description[?]:
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Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The government's position towards the use of forensic DNA databases.
Old value:: No DNA is recorded.
Current: DNA from persons accused or convicted for a crime is recorded.
Proposed: Only DNA from persons convicted of crime is recorded.
Article 2
Proposal[?] to change Education in prisons.
Old value:: An education plan for prisoners is provided to improve rehabilitation.
Current: An education plan for prisoners is provided to improve rehabilitation.
Proposed: Prisoners are not given any form of education.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 21:55:26, June 04, 2008 CET | From |  Obshestvo Stroiteley Terri | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | Come on, I really dont like the second point. |
| Date | 22:10:08, June 04, 2008 CET | From | Christian Conservative Party | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | same |
| Date | 02:20:14, June 05, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | We agree with the second point, conversely. Prison is not a place for criminals to learn, or to earn money. It is a place for them to be punished, and only to be punished. The whole point of prison is that their movement is restricted - they are locked in a cell day in, day out, for the duration of their sentance. The Family First Party does not believe in rehabilitation - we do not believe it has any great merit, nor has it shown any particularly good results. It is immensely difficult to try and change a person's entire psychology, especially when the motivations for crime have been imbedded in them from their childhood and upbringing. The only way to diminish crime is to make sure that prison is not a desirable place. Prison shouldn't be simply a small replica of the outside world, where criminals can go to the gym, have steak dinners, watch TV, learn things, and have a job earning a small wage. If that's what prison is, people are going to be trying to break IN, not OUT. Prison should be prison. Prison should be a place that criminals dread and fear, a place so awful that they re-think their actions. This is a sensible piece of legislation. We thoroughly support. |
| Date | 14:59:04, June 05, 2008 CET | From | Obshestvo Stroiteley Terri | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | Firstly, if you say that prison can not make a person better, then there is no reason for any other sentence than one which is for lifetime. Secondly, I believe we should differentiate between shoplifters and murderers. It is OK and fully acceptable to teach things to persons coming from bad surroundings. Maybe they are in prison because they did not see any other way to earn their living. Off course here I speak about "economical crimes" (dont know better term for that, but those are persons who did not kill, did not rape, did not whatever, but got their living by taking financial means from other persons). When they are young and motivated enough there is still time to change. I do agree that prison should not be a Hotel and should be an unpleasant place, so that those youngsters are motivated to learn new business, get out of there and never get back. |
| Date | 15:01:00, June 05, 2008 CET | From | Obshestvo Stroiteley Terri | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | And, sorry, small remark, I love to see that debating culture is here! It is always great to exchange views |
| Date | 15:31:18, June 05, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | We do believe that criminals of a lesser callibre, such as those committing crimes involving pety theft, etc, may have a chance at changing their ways. But it is overly idealistic and hopeful to believe that they will change through education in prison, and this approach hasn't yielded any results worthy of mentioning. The Family First Party believes that crimes should be, where possible, prevented before they happen. This requires a strong deterrance, involving severe sentances that criminals will dread enough to want to avoid at all costs. But in the cases where criminals have committed crimes even in spite of the consequences, we believe that their prison sentance should be a punishment, rather than a learning experience, and we believe that the severity of the punishment itself is enough to deter the criminal in question from ever willingly committing such a crime again. Simply put, the FFP does not believe in the merit of rehabilitation, nor do we believe that it should be the focus of sentances for criminals. We believe that if criminals committ crimes they should be punished, and this is not just for incapacitation, or deterrance, but for retribution as well - in order for criminals to recieve a punishment proportionate to their crime, to repent for what they have done, it is important that their time in jail is an experience of punishment; not an experience of learning and education. |
| Date | 20:15:10, June 05, 2008 CET | From | Obshestvo Stroiteley Terri | To | Debating the Make prisoners suffer greatly. |
| Message | Please compare Level of Prison standarts in Norway and level of crime in Norway with Level of prison in Russia and level of crime in Russia (USA would work as well)! That is a real life! |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||
| yes |
Total Seats: 170 | |||
| no |
Total Seats: 385 | |||
| abstain |
Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: "Jezvraljogadsrlji" means "Social" in the Jelbic languages. |
| Random quote: "You can't get rid of poverty by giving people money." - P. J. O'Rourke |