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Bill: Legal Aid
Details
Submitted by[?]: LibCom Party
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: July 2041
Description[?]:
In order to ensure fair trials, all defendants must be entitled to independent legal representation of their own choosing, free of charge. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change Government provision of legal aid to the accused.
Old value:: Legal representation is never paid for by the state.
Current: Legal representation for defendants in criminal trials is paid for by the state for defendants with low incomes.
Proposed: Legal representation for defendants in criminal trials is paid for by the state.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
Date | not recorded | From | Labour Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | Obviously we need legal aid, this better not present defense lawyers with a blank cheque. |
Date | not recorded | From | LibCom Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | No, there'll be a set rate. Not too sure how it works in RL - I assume it's set hourly rates for a solicitor to prepare the case and a barrister to do the business in court. (In the UK, that is - that's the only court system I have any experience with.) |
Date | not recorded | From | Leviathan Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | We may wish to consider an alternative here, where the state would only pay for the trial expenses of low income defendants. Provided we keep the public defenders well staffed and properly compensated, we could ensure adequate representation without allowing rich defendants to saddle the state with the bill when they go on trial for tax evasion or embezzlement. |
Date | not recorded | From | Protectorate Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | I imagine rich defendents will go the route of paying their own to maximize their chance of success. (Think OJ trial) I doubt that high profiled attorneys will work at state rates. I am in favor of this bill, it protects the middle class as well which the other option will not. |
Date | not recorded | From | LibCom Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | Also, means testing can end up costing more than it saves - apparently that was the case in the UK, so they quietly dropped it. |
Date | not recorded | From | Labour Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | The highest profile criminal derfence advocate in Scotland at the moment (Donald Findlay) is also the recipient of the most legal aid payments, £267,000 in 2002/03. I do think though that anyone, no matter how much they ean, should be entitled to free representation if they are the subject of criminal proceedings. It's a complex area though and in real life the legislation would be pretty indepth. Clearly we don't have that luxury so I'm inclined to support the proposal as it is. |
Date | not recorded | From | LibCom Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | I'd like to move this to a vote before I bugger off for the weekend. If anyone objects, please say so now. |
Date | not recorded | From | Leviathan Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | We object, as we would have liked to explore the option of only giving legal aid to those who truly cannot afford it. |
Date | not recorded | From | LibCom Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | But assuming we have progressive taxation, the rich pay for it anyway. |
Date | not recorded | From | Leviathan Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | And that's all that is, right now, an assumption. |
Date | not recorded | From | Labour Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | It's still possible to revisit the bill when the economy is implemented and we know more about the tax system. Besides - we educate the children of the rich for free; we heal the rich for free; we should allow the rich to defend themselves in court for free. Untill we look at it again anyway. |
Date | not recorded | From | Social Republican Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | I agree with labour. |
Date | not recorded | From | Radical Centrists | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | We offer our support. |
Date | not recorded | From | Leviathan Party | To | Debating the Legal Aid |
Message | We are swayed, and vote yes. |
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Voting
Vote | Seats | ||||||||
yes |
Total Seats: 95 | ||||||||
no | Total Seats: 0 | ||||||||
abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
Random fact: If your "Bills under debate" section is cluttered up with old bills created by inactive parties, report them for deletion on the Bill Clearouts Requests thread: http://forum.particracy.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4363 |
Random quote: "I got nothing against no Viet Cong. No Vietnamese ever called me a nigger." - Muhammad Ali, 1967, refusing to fight in Vietnam |