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Bill: Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP)
Details
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: December 2143
Description[?]:
| The Jacobite Party formally invites Pope Innocent I, the Head of the Catholic Church, to come and visit the faithful in the Aldurian Republic. We invite the Pope to oversee mass at the great Catholic Cathedral of Aldur City, to be followed by a tour of the Aldurian regions. We hope for this to be the first official visit by the Pope to see his flock outside of Deltaria, and we look forward to his acceptance of this invitation. |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 13:35:26, November 18, 2005 CET | From | Bátory Dynastia | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Grófka Alžbeta Bátoriová-Nádašdyová, at the behest of the Deltarian Vatikan, is pleased to announce that the Supreme Pontiff, Pápež Innocent I, has happily accepted the gracious invitation. The Pápež has expressed wishes to discuss matters of local importance with Aldurian cardinals, bishops, down to rural parish priests. The Pápež will travel to the Aldurian Republic as soon as necessary arrangements can be made for his personal security. |
| Date | 17:50:06, November 18, 2005 CET | From |  Aldurian Libertarian Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | The JP is the new State Party ? Also, even if many aldurian consider themselves as religious, they are not automatically 'Deltarian catholic', not catholic at all. The pope should have the same consideration as any other head of state and we hope it will accept the invitation. However, we will not support a bill that hope to 'bring religion back into our schools, hospitals and decision making bodies'. |
| Date | 19:55:51, November 18, 2005 CET | From | Market Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | We will not allow the government to show its support of religion and we will vote no. |
| Date | 23:26:46, November 18, 2005 CET | From | Aldurian Moderates | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | We agree with the MSP. |
| Date | 02:59:38, November 19, 2005 CET | From | United Socialist Front | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | We honestly could not care any less. The Pope wants to visit? Excellent, let him visit. Really though, does he even need an invitation? No one needs an invitation to visit this country! Let them come and go as they please... We probably won't vote on this at all. |
| Date | 04:12:23, November 19, 2005 CET | From | Aldurian Libertarian Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Well oppose because the proposal express a will to 'bring religion back into our schools, hospitals and decision making bodies' which is far from the secular nature of our republic. |
| Date | 10:45:50, November 19, 2005 CET | From | Market Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Please vote against this bill, USF. It is rather important that the government reiterates the fact that it is a secular and impartial body. It is relatively unemplortant that the Pope visits...however, it would be a symbol of the influence of religion on state. |
| Date | 23:48:31, November 19, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Hang on a minute, this is a resolution, there were no proposals suggesting a promotion of religion, that was a personal view of the Jacobites. The Head of State of a foreign nation needs an invitation to come to Alduria, he cannot just turn up unannounced. (To the ALSP) all catholics in this nation are catholics, Pope Innocent I is our head, even if there are only five Catholics in this nation (which is doubtful), the Pope should be allowed to come and see them. (To the MSP): Allowing the Pope to see his followers, that is hardly the government supporting religion. We see no reason for any party to not allow a religious figure to visit his flock, to deny him that right would be very discriminative indeed, Oh and we have removed anyhting that may 'offend' any secular parties. |
| Date | 00:42:28, November 20, 2005 CET | From | United Socialist Front | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Well, they did remove the not so secular parts. Still, we'll put a different recolution up. |
| Date | 00:58:47, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | er, why? |
| Date | 04:58:34, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Progressive Social Liberty Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | This is in now way a support for religious state affiliation. We simply believe its good for the country if the leader of any respectable church wants to visit. Let this open the door for more internationalist tendencies in this country. |
| Date | 11:56:41, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Thankyou to the PSLP for accepting that religious leaders have a right to visit their followers, at times other than which the government want (as suggested in another bill currently being proposed), to the Aldurian Moderates, why? What is moderate about not allowing religious leaders into a nation? |
| Date | 12:51:30, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Market Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Do be an idiot JP. Of course Pope Innocent can see his followers, but the government should not be allowed to invite him. An official invitation would show that the state favours the catholic religion over the other...and indeed over the secular state of affairs. |
| Date | 13:20:29, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Pope Innocent I is the Head of State of another nation, therefore he has to be invited, he cannot simply turn up. It would be exactly the same if the Caliph of Al'Badara wanted to see Muslims in Alduria, he couldn't simply arrive it would have to be done officially. Obviously if an Archbishop wanted to visit, there would be no problems, but something like the Pope, especially one who is the HoS of another nation definitly needs an invitation, that is common sense. |
| Date | 13:57:06, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Market Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Than he can be invited by the catholic church of Alduria. |
| Date | 14:20:46, November 20, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | Thats what I have done. But still you do not listen. A HoS must be invited officially by the government of a nation, he cannot just turn up, it must be officially authorised by the government of the state he wishes to visit. Please tell me you understand that. |
| Date | 02:31:06, November 21, 2005 CET | From | Aldurian Libertarian Socialist Party | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | >(To the ALSP) all catholics in this nation are catholics, Pope Innocent I is our head, even if there are only five Catholics in this nation (which is doubtful), the Pope should be allowed to come and see them. Mythomany again. We never suggested to ban the pope from making a tour. To cite our own words: "The pope should have the same consideration as any other head of state and we hope it will accept the invitation." >Oh and we have removed anyhting that may 'offend' any secular parties. The text of the bill is still 'tinted' with a religious taste : "We hope for this to be the first official visit by the Pope to see his flock outside of Deltaria, and we look forward to his acceptance of this invitatio" He's not visiting the people of alduria ? He visits ITS folks (co beleivers) ? Another thing that is offensive, although as a democratic point of view rather than a secular one, is the formulation 'The Jacobite Party formally invites'. We will oppose on this virtue. It may seems a technicality, but thats a question of principle. |
| Date | 05:10:52, November 21, 2005 CET | From | Aldurian Moderates | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | To the JP: We fail to see where we denouced the right of any religious leaders to come into a nation. We just see no need for the government to make the formal invitation. Are the Catholics of Alduria incapable of doing this themselves? Also, if the Pope wishes to come to visit his flock, he can do so as a religious leader without operating as a Head of State. As long as he keeps his trip purely religious without mentioning politics, there's no need to invite him as a head of state. In fact we see no reason to bring the Head of State issue into light until there is some hidden political agenda to this "invite" |
| Date | 12:30:17, November 21, 2005 CET | From | Jacobites | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | How many fucking times do I have to say it. A HoS needs an official invitiation, can you not understand that? |
| Date | 00:31:55, November 22, 2005 CET | From | Aldurian Moderates | To | Debating the Invitation to Pope Innocent I (RP) |
| Message | I understand that the Pope maintains a duel role of Spirtiual Leader and Political Leader. Is he incapable of preforming one aspect without having the other interfere? |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||
| yes | Total Seats: 220 | |||
| no | Total Seats: 122 | |||
| abstain | Total Seats: 59 |
| Random fact: References to prominent real-life persons are not allowed. This includes references to philosophies featuring the name of a real-life person (eg. "Marxism", "Thatcherism", "Keynesianism"). |
| Random quote: "If God had wanted us to vote, he would have given us candidates." - Jay Leno |