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Bill: Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1
Details
Submitted by[?]: Aster Federation Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: November 3251
Description[?]:
In order to save the Jelibanian People many billions of taxpayer funds, this bill has been put forward for proposal,eliminating costly, ineffective, and obsolete units from Jelbania's Navy. The core aim is to scrap the two battleships named Rilmos and Stephen Kennedy IV and instead focus on giving Jelbania a strong fleet of Offshore Patrol Vessels (OPV's) and a carrier which actually will float. The current carrier design, submitted by Pittwater Cove Industries, has been proven to be unstable and not conventional by most means. Therefore we ask that a conglomerate of nationally owned defense contractors share the industry with the private firms which has been answered and we hope keep in such manner.
Original Tonnage- 2,041,000 tons
Desired Tonnage- 1,020,500 tons
Removed items- 2 Rilmos Super-Battleships(To be scrapped),3 Stalingrad-IVs(Two to be sold, one to be scrapped),10 Stalingrad-Vs,16 Slava Cruisers (10 to be scrapped, 2 to be sunk by SINEX and 4 placed in reserve) and 2 Typhoon Submarines (to be recycled and dismantled).
Removed Tonnage- 972,000
Retained Tonnage- 1,059,000
Retained Items- 4 Nimitz Carriers, 6 Charles De Gaulle Carriers, 1 Stalingrad-IV (retained solely for training purposes and as home fleet flagship),24 Udaloy-II Destroyers,40 Admiral Gorshov Frigates,52 Steguschimy Corvettes, 8 Akula Submarines and 22 Kilo Submarines
Replacements (items replaced in brackets)- 12 Guided Missile Cruisers of a displacement not greater than 12,000 tons and no less than 9,000 tons. Cruisers are to be a Jelbanian indigenous design (replacing 16 Slava Cruisers), 9 Admiral Gorshov Frigates, 23 Steguschimy Corvettes, 3 new SSBN's that are between the tonnage of 7,500 and 12,500 tons(surfaced). These Submarines are to be a Jelbanian indigenous design (replacing 2 Typhoon SSBNs) and 2 Kilo Submarines. Also in 10 years the first of the Udaloy-II Class Destroyers will be obsolete, necessitating a new class of 20-25 new destroyers in the 9000-7000 ton range. These Destroyers are to be a Jelbanian indigenous design (replacing 24 Udaloy-II Destroyers). Also to free up large combatants from patrol, a suggested 30-45 patrol vessels that span the 400-1900 ton gap. These patrol vessels are to be a Jelbanian indigenous design.
Estimated Replacement tonnage-337,700 absolute minimum to a maximum of 578,600 tons
Whilst the replacement tonnage is just in excess of half of the removed tonnage, pause for a moment to consider that the removed obsolete battleships and battle-cruisers together made up 80% of the tonnage. That's 776,000 tons replaced by useful and advanced warships that are new, cheaper, less exhaustive and most importantly Jelbanian |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
Date | 12:39:07, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | This bill will be passed after the next elections which are coming either early or on March 3251 and nothing can stop the fact that this bill will eventually pass. The Jelbanian Liberal Front could be quite possibly accused of wanton spending at everyone's expense! |
Date | 13:00:23, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | Our Defense Minister, Alexander Hadley has mentioned that such arsenal ships would cost more over a lifespan than a Nimtiz Carrier, He stated a starting figure of 7.5 Billion Universal Standard Dollars and a cost of 250 milllion USD per year. Thats not to mention overhauls, refueling and decommisionning which may run over ten Billion USD. |
Date | 13:02:00, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Jelbanian Liberty Front | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | The Arsenal Ships are nuclear powered and they are easy to maintain for a country that has 97,000,000,000 Majatran Telars in the Defense budjet. |
Date | 13:15:04, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | These "Arsenal Ships" will be a drain on our navy which receives about 16 Billion Majatran Telars. The future for the Jelbanian Navy is small compact units that pack advanced technology, not brutes that burn taxpayer money like bunker oil |
Date | 13:20:19, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | We are not emplacing arsenal ships upon the bill, recognizing the fact that the concept of arsenal ships is genuinely flawed, as 10 or more smaller ships can do the same job over a larger area. |
Date | 13:26:56, January 26, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | 7.5 Billion for a experiment? I doubt it will be beneficial except as an example of how not to spent taxpayer money. A study perhaps? After all time and paper is relatively cheap. |
Date | 06:54:21, January 27, 2012 CET |
From | Jelbanian Liberty Front | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | The Gaduris and Jelbanians have a secret battleship program and the Marine corps wants 5 of the 10 Stalingrad-Vs to be retained for fire support. |
Date | 08:13:29, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | The Gaduris also have a 80% greater defense spending than Jelbania, if they wish to waste their ample funds on experiments with extinct warships so be it but not us as well. The Marines Corps intentions have been heard and we hope to supplement a 5" gun of our future destroyers and possibly the same mount or a compact 8" single on the 12 cruisers that we specify in our plan. |
Date | 08:33:21, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Jelbanian Liberty Front | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | They want five of the Stalingrad-Vs to be retained as fire support ships,can't you get it and can we RP the exercise where the Targets are filled with 20 jars of nitroglycinine,10 pounds of Sinxex,20 tons of dynamite,and 4 tons of Smokeless Powder. |
Date | 08:47:07, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Jelbanian Liberty Front | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | The 15 incher is the best in the Jelbanian arsenal as it can penetrate bunkers and fire support is critical in amphibious landings near fortresses and the Propellent is LEC and can't we RP the Sinxex? |
Date | 09:50:26, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | (Just will not, not that I intend on going on it) And when will be the day the Marine Corp need fire support? Its hardly likely they will be storming the gates of hell, We've been told that a 8" gun has double the lining lifetime expectancy and better results for a smaller package. Why overcompensate with the larger gun? |
Date | 10:19:36, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | A Fortress could fall under the much more effect earthquake bomb effect but we doubt there are any fortresses that we should be able not the deal with. |
Date | 11:10:46, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Jelbanian Liberty Front | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | I am referring to Bunkers that are designed to store ammo and the dead Iraqi's killed in Iraq's bunkers because of USS Missouri and Wisconsins shells may disagree with you. |
Date | 11:17:15, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | (RL cross overs shouldn't be used) No modern army or armed force would use bunkers that intensive if they could loose them in intrusive actions |
Date | 11:36:14, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | The debate for the Stalingrads fate is over (the Bill will remain as is). if any other party would like to raise a point, please go ahead and do not hesitate |
Date | 12:07:53, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | For the sake of the people, the taxpayers and the navy, we believe it would be best to halt work on these vessels until this bill is defeated or passed |
Date | 12:11:24, January 29, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | For the sake of the people, the taxpayers and the navy, we believe it would be best to halt work on these vessels until this bill is defeated or passed |
Date | 14:24:21, January 30, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | Why bother with costly Battleships when you can have cheaper cruisers which will still do the job? Carriers have radar, which would pick up a target like a battleship at a long distance, enough time (about 3-4 hours) to scramble aircraft. |
Date | 11:45:35, January 31, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | Today in this modern age a nations ideal of naval strength is a carrier not a outdated battleship. The debate for the Battleships, Battlesruisers and Arsenal Ships is over (the Bill will remain as is). If any other party would like to raise a point, please go ahead and do not hesitate |
Date | 12:00:15, January 31, 2012 CET |
From | Aster Federation Party | To | Debating the Naval Efficiency Bill 1.1 | Message | May the Jelbanian Liberty Front please present a structured and actually relevant reason that holds water to why they have voted to deny the Jelbanian People their taxpayer funds? |
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Seats |
yes | Total Seats: 101 |
no | Total Seats: 262 |
abstain | Total Seats: 337 |
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