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Bill: Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth
Details
Submitted by[?]: Great National Republican Guard
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This bill proposes for the ratification of a treaty. It will require two-thirds of the legislature to vote in favor[?]. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: May 3554
Description[?]:
| Should we join the Indralan Commonwealth? http://classic.particracy.net/viewtreaty.php?treatyid=2486 While the original treaty didn't allow sovereign republics to join, there is an amendment that we can ratify which excuses us from having to recognize the Indralan monarch's claim as Sovereign of Lodamun: http://classic.particracy.net/viewbill.php?billid=387296 By ratifying both, we would be a part of the Indralan Commonwealth without having to bow down to a foreign leader. -- Indralan politicians, and representatives of other nations in the Commonwealth, are allowed to comment on the matter. |
Proposals
Article 1
Ratify the Indralan Commonwealth.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 02:31:38, July 19, 2013 CET | From |  Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We are pleased that an amendment has been made to allow republics to join. We will still recognize the Indralan monarch as head of the Commonwealth, but not Head of State of our nation. We are not, however, pleased with Article 3 of the treaty. We do not want to make such a commitment to any nation. -- Nigel Anderson, Defence Minister |
| Date | 00:27:56, July 22, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | There is no reason for us to join the Indralan Commonwealth. We have no historical or cultural ties with them and we have a strong and fierce tradition of republicanism. Lodamun should be a strong, powerful, independent nation. Victor Steele, LFP Leader |
| Date | 13:39:32, July 22, 2013 CET | From |  姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, I must first say that Lodamun does have a history of economic exchanges with Indrala, along with the major historical tie being that Lodamun was once under the rule of the Anantan Empire, founded by Indralan migrants to Kalistan. Indrala has claimed to be a successor to that state, thus granting us our claims. Regardless of claims, Indrala wants to build a good relationship with the states of North Seleya, South Dovani, and the former states of the Anantan Empire. Lodamun can do this by ratifying the Indralan Commonwealth and the amendment allowing for republics. The Indralan Commonwealth can be a force for spreading culture and education throughout our respective states and bring our peoples closer together. Peace and stability in the region is something I think most states want. The Indralan Commonwealth will secure it, especially with Lodamun's entry. |
| Date | 16:56:17, July 22, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Lodamun could alternative go about building goods relations with Indrala, and other strategic partners, in more conventional and more realistic ways. My party will fight for Lodamun's independence and will do everything we can to prevent Lodamun from being lead blindly into this treaty. Lodamun should not be subject to Indrala, we're a strong and proud nation, not a weak one. Victor Steele, LFP Leader |
| Date | 16:56:51, July 22, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | OOC: *alternatively *good Major grammar fail. |
| Date | 00:42:04, July 23, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, Lodamun would not be a "subject to Indrala", rather, Lodamun would be an equal partner. Indrala is always open to expanding relations with Lodamun, whether it is through the Commonwealth or some other means. |
| Date | 02:20:44, July 23, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We apologize for the Federal Party's stupidity. They have not read anything; they've only made statements based on their assumptions, hormones, and emotions. I would love for them to show us where exactly the treaties prevent Lodamun from being independent. -- Cullen Scrivenor, Foreign Minister |
| Date | 04:37:53, July 23, 2013 CET | From | Communist Party of Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | The Communist Party believe that all Terrans should coexist in peace and harmony and from what I see this treaty promotes that goal. With that being said, we have no issue in becoming signatories. |
| Date | 12:44:50, July 23, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Lodamun should not be part of another country's Commonwealth, and especially not a Commonwealth of a monarchist nation. That is our view. If it is difficult to understand than we apologise for taking such a complicated stance. Regarding the comments made by the Nationalists, we are most surprised that a nationalist party is proposing to join another country's Commonwealth. Similarly, we are surprised that communists would wish to join a Commonwealth lead by a monarchist nation. Again, Lodamun could easily have a relationship with Indrala without being part of her Commonwealth. Victor Steele, LFP Leader |
| Date | 13:37:01, July 23, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speakers, We thank the Communist Party for their support. Indeed, Indrala only wants peace and harmony with Lodamun. In regards to Mr. Steele's statement, I must say that the Commonwealth is composed of equal members. No one member is superior. The first conference will take place in Egelion and serve as a "coming out" party, if you will, of the organization. Having the conference in Egelion is symbolic of the fact that the Commonwealth is committed to promote equality amongst its members. At the conference, no doubt there will be discussions of leadership. Obviously, a possible leadership structure would be rotating leadership, allowing each nation to take the reigns. Would this be something that Lodamun would be interested in? |
| Date | 14:52:52, July 23, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | The federalists obviously just want something to bitch about. They still haven't proven how joining the Commonwealth revokes our independence. Perhaps Miss Steele is on her period. -- Edwin Fertig, President |
| Date | 15:31:42, July 23, 2013 CET | From | Lodamese Green Party | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | The Greens are officially neutral on the matter of the Indralan Commonwealth. William Johnson Minister of Environment and Tourism Chairman of the Lodamese Green Party |
| Date | 16:52:59, July 23, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | If the name of the organisation was 'the Commonwealth', not the 'Indralan Commonwealth', then I would be inclined to agree that it is an organisation of equals, but that is not the case so we are opposed to joining. Furthermore, Lodamun could have better relations with Indrala without having to join her Commonwealth. Luthori, another imperialist nation, has numerous bilateral treaties rather than its own 'Commonwealth'. Victor Steele, LFP Leader |
| Date | 00:43:02, July 24, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, It is called the "Indralan Commonwealth" because it was founded in Indrala. We maintain that it is an organization of equals, hence why we allowed for the Republican amendment. Actually, Luthori does have a Commonwealth specifically for nations with monarchies that related to the Luthori and Hulstrian monarch. Only monarchies can join and they must be related to the Luthori and Hulstrian monarch. In this instance, their Commonwealth is far more restrictive. As previously stated, we are open to improving relations with Lodamun by any means. |
| Date | 01:24:09, July 24, 2013 CET | From | United Struggle for Blacks in Lodamun | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Then I can only repeat: my part opposes joining Indrala's Commonwealth. Victor Steele, LFP Leader |
| Date | 04:07:54, July 24, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Great. We've heard it already. We don't need to hear it again. While the LNP supports joining the Commonwealth, we have a few extra demands which we wish to discuss. This is for discussion of the treaties; your opposition is already noted, so you don't need to continue talking. I don't care about your party, and I do not refer to any party as "my party" - the LNP is a party of the people. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
| Date | 04:39:40, July 24, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, What else is needed for the LNP to support? |
| Date | 04:45:08, July 24, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We support Article 2, but we strongly oppose Articles 1, 3, and 8. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
| Date | 13:33:51, July 24, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, On what pretenses besides national sovereignty does Lodamun oppose those articles? Article 1 will improve all of our economies. Free trade, according to many economists, is beneficial to all nations and makes goods and services cheaper for consumers, ultimately benefiting them, thus our respective nations. Article 8 is important because it really shows the Commonwealth will not tolerate heinous crimes. Obviously minor crimes are truly not be of such a high concern, but if a man killing hundreds in Lodamun fled to Indrala, we would want to extradite him back to Lodamun to face justice in the lands in which he committed the crime, thus promoting your legal system and showing off your national culture and sovereignty. |
| Date | 20:21:36, July 24, 2013 CET | From | Democratic Party | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr Speaker We oppose this commonwealth idea, first we don't want to tied to Indrala in terms of militaristic action. Deltaria is a target in Majatra and Indrala defends her all of the time but we don't want to participate every single war of Indrala, I get that line was for any action against Indrala but Indrala doesn't count any action against Deltaria is against Indrala, this is a huge loophole. Cheap Indralan labour would hurt Lodamunese labour. Extradition has to be regulated, obviously we don't give political victims to any country back. Also sir, without Indrala and all of the members ratified that treaty, we are not assured by this assurance. In the end we oppose it. I yield. Annabelle Michaud Leader of Democrats |
| Date | 21:13:26, July 24, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We will not make any exceptions to our hardline stances on matters such as tariffs and extradition. We will not make permanent promises for things we can't foresee. Things like war and extradition will need our approval on a case-by-case basis. We cannot promise to side with Indrala in all its conflicts. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
| Date | 00:56:48, July 25, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, Why does Lodamun feel he need to have such a hardline stance on tariffs and extraditions? I understand your concern for the security proposals, but a direct attack on the physical territory of Indrala Proper, Egelion, or Lodamun is quite improbable, especially if all three were united. However, I will give thought to this measure and get back to you. |
| Date | 01:55:05, July 25, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | It is not Lodamun; it is simply the LNP's stance, which seems to be somewhat shared by other parties. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
| Date | 02:51:30, July 25, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, The question still remains: Why is your stance so hardline? |
| Date | 03:27:49, July 25, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | Because we are against extradition promises, and we don't believe anyone should get such special treatment that tariffs are removed completely. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
| Date | 13:29:04, July 25, 2013 CET | From | 姬恩黨 (Jien Faction) 🌄 | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We can understand your party's view on extradition promises, but most economists agree that free trade is beneficial to economies, so the Lodamese economy would greatly benefit. |
| Date | 15:10:27, July 25, 2013 CET | From | Great National Republican Guard | To | Debating the Ratification of the Indralan Commonwealth |
| Message | We are protectionist. We do not buy the "free trade" crap. Notice we withdrew from treaties that prevented tariffs and so on. We will not allow foreign goods to have equal competition with ours through prices. This invasion of our economy, whether better for the economy or not, is not in the interest of the Nationalists. Our stance remains the same. You have to accept it, convince other parties to support the Commonwealth, or walk away. -- Edwin Fertig, LNP Leader |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||
| yes | Total Seats: 0 | |||
| no | Total Seats: 203 | |||
| abstain | Total Seats: 97 |
| Random fact: Particracy has 464 player slots. |
| Random quote: "It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong." - Voltaire |