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Bill: Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive)
Details
Submitted by[?]: Coalition for National Unity [CNU]
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This bill presents the formation of a cabinet. It requires more than half of the legislature to vote yes. Traditionally, parties in the proposal vote yes, others (the opposition) vote no. This bill will pass as soon as the required yes votes are in and all parties in the proposal have voted yes, or will be defeated if unsufficient votes are reached on the deadline.
Voting deadline: April 3809
Description[?]:
| The initial proposal for negotiation... This option sees the CNP allocated four seats for being the second largest party, the Unionists allocated 3 for being the third largest party and an additional 2 for being Head of State, the RCS allocated 3 for being the fourth largest party and the SDP allocated one for being the smallest party. |
Proposals
Article 1
As per the Constitution, the President chairs the cabinet.
Article 2
The responsibilites of Science and Technology will be conducted by the 
Coalition for National Unity [CNU]
Article 3
The responsibilites of Food and Agriculture will be conducted by the Radical Republican Party (RRP)
Article 4
The responsibilites of Environment and Tourism will be conducted by the Chann National Party (CNP)
Article 5
The responsibilites of Trade and Industry will be conducted by the Radical Republican Party (RRP)
Article 6
The responsibilites of Foreign Affairs will be conducted by the Coalition for National Unity [CNU]
Article 7
The responsibilites of Internal Affairs will be conducted by the Chann National Party (CNP)
Article 8
The responsibilites of Finance will be conducted by the Chann National Party (CNP)
Article 9
The responsibilites of Defence will be conducted by the Radical Republican Party (RRP)
Article 10
The responsibilites of Justice will be conducted by the Communist Party of Solentia (CPS)
Article 11
The responsibilites of Infrastructure and Transport will be conducted by the Coalition for National Unity [CNU]
Article 12
The responsibilites of Health and Social Services will be conducted by the Chann National Party (CNP)
Article 13
The responsibilites of Education and Culture will be conducted by the Coalition for National Unity [CNU]
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 21:30:47, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Free Democratic Party | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "Our party is simply insulted. The power-hungry Unionists have once again exerted hypocritical, unfair, and almost evil legislation that directly attacks the people of our great nation. They know what their doing, and they're using every dirty trick in the book. The people deserve better than this." ~Ron Ran, Head Chairman of the LCC |
| Date | 21:35:06, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "There is nothing "unfair" or "evil" about proposing a four-party coalition Government. The LCC needs to place their petty partisan politics aside and recognise that the majority of parties in Solentia want a stable, sensible Government; we have tried to reflect that desire in our proposal. Perhaps the other parties will reject it; we do not know as of yet. However we are determined to try and command a majority of the Senate after four long years of political stalemate and an LCC Supreme President who was simply not up to the job." Mykail Rafferty, Unionist leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 21:41:20, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Free Democratic Party | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "How are we partisan? We believe the most partisan of all is the SDP and the Unionists who abuse the government to obtain more power. The CNP and the RCP generally have medium partisanship. We are the least partisan. We support small government, and that is the opposite of partisanship. Anyways, the political stalemate was due to a lack of compromise coming from the smaller parties. We made proposals to change and improve the government, while the other parties did nothing. Explain to us why our party won the senate again if our stalemate hurt our country so badly. Our party is outraged at your constant political shrewdness that is causing millions of people in this nation stress at the potential authoritarian dictatorship Rafferty wants." ~William Paul, Secondary Chairman of the LCC |
| Date | 21:48:58, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "Political stalemate for four years is not because smaller parties do something it is because the largest party; your own party, proved unable to command a majority of the Senate. We are trying to remedy that by accepting the CNP's call for a new cabinet and negotiating a Government arrangement that is fair and balanced. The CNP, SDP and RCS have all worked with us before and have found each other to be moderate and sensible even when we disagree. It seems reasonable therefore to try and produce a cabinet that reflects that moderate, centrist feel." Mykail Rafferty, Unionist leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 22:28:57, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Radical Republican Party (RRP) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | We support this bill. For the sake of transparency we would like to say the following; Our defence minister would be moderatly militarist Our FaA minister would be pro decentralization Our TaI minister would be heavily pro-union |
| Date | 22:56:31, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "I am aware of some minor policy differences between the Unionists and the RCS on the matter of Defence. That is, of course, the nature of politics and we trust we can find a cooperative relationship that allows for such differences." Mykail Rafferty, Unionist leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 23:45:14, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Communist Party of Solentia (CPS) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | Merely 3% less votes of SDP comparing to RCS results in 66% less ministry allocation?! We would like to question this proposal based on these grounds. Max Hart, Chairman of SDP |
| Date | 23:48:39, February 26, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "The proposal was not based on the mathematics of allocation but instead on the principle of fairness...the second largest party was given 4 seats, the next two were given 3 and the final was given 1." Mykail Rafferty, Unionist Leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 00:03:38, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Communist Party of Solentia (CPS) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | This is all subjective. Talking about fairness: in the old times, all the parties in coalition who worked together a lot were given nearly equal number of cabinet positions, with the largest party of coalition taking the prime minister post. It was not subjective, and the fairness was not quantititive but qualitative, we have not used any mathematics. But we don't know what mathematics have you used while picking these arbitrary weights. Max Hart, Chairman of SDP |
| Date | 02:24:38, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Chann National Party (CNP) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | We believe as the largest party in this proposed coalition, that the position of Senate Warden should be a CNP member. Although we are open to reasons why it should not be given to the largest party in the coalition. |
| Date | 02:30:41, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Free Democratic Party | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "We believe that the largest party in the senate should have at least 3 spots, and that is a major compromise. The political stalemate was caused by the Unionist coalition and the people who voted at the recent election knew that. This is the most preposterous and unbelievable thing in the history of Solenian politics. Such partisanship is awful. Our party feels insulted, unfairly treated, and betrayed. The people of Solenia feel insulted, unfairly treated, and betrayed, and you know it." ~Ron Rand, Head Chairman of the LCC |
| Date | 02:32:58, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Chann National Party (CNP) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | We ask the LCC to reassess its comments, with all due respect. The family of the CNP came from a country dominated by two parties ... coming to Solentia, we have learned that it is a different political landscape. Simply because a party wins a "majority" of seats as compared to other parties doesn't mean it has a realistic majority in terms of policy making. Majority in Solentia, as in other nations, means atleast more than half of the legislature - In Solentia, that often means coalition building. There are few times where Solentians as a whole feel with absolute surety that one single party can do the job. The CNP itself has had only two terms (8 years) within recent history with which we've commanded an absolute majority and that was under Mao Xin Fuwan in 3758. It happens very seldomnly. |
| Date | 02:38:15, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Free Democratic Party | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "How is our party still not respected even though the people prefer our form of freedom most, though? We are popular in the general public, but we are road blocked from doing the public's will in legislation." ~William Paul, Secondary Chairman of the LCC |
| Date | 19:41:36, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "The decision to propose a Unionist HoG was based on two factors; the first being that we are ideologically centre of the four parties in the proposal, the second being that we are the only member to have worked with all of the other members in the past. We are, however, open to hear the case for an alternative; it is not a sticking point." Mykail Rafferty, Unionist leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 20:49:30, February 27, 2015 CET | From | Communist Party of Solentia (CPS) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | We think Unionists should have Senate Warden post because they have won the presidency. But we still disagree with the number of positions allocated for SDP. This is not what is fair to do after "cooperation between our two parties". Remember, SDP have supported your presidential candidate too. Max Hart, SDP chairman |
| Date | 00:55:53, February 28, 2015 CET | From | Chann National Party (CNP) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | The SDP reasoning is noteworthy, but logic is unsound. The party that controls the presidency does not necessarily control the senate wardenship. As the SDP has correctly stated, generally the Senate Warden has gone to the party with the largest number of seats in the coalition, as evidenced by the last cabinet when the Unionists were second largest party nationwide and the largest party in the previous majority coalition. While the Unionists argument that they have experience working with the four parties, we are of the position that the SDP and Unionists are far left while the CNP and RCS dominate the center of the political spectrum. We are still not convinced that the wardenship should remain with the Unionists since the Senate Warden is also considered as a de facto "speaker of the house" or "senate majority leader" (OOC: In American Terms) it is only customary to have the warden of the senate be from the party which is in the stronger position to do so numerically. |
| Date | 00:57:02, February 28, 2015 CET | From | Chann National Party (CNP) | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | As the SDP has opined in this very record: "Talking about fairness: in the old times, all the parties in coalition who worked together a lot were given nearly equal number of cabinet positions, with the largest party of coalition taking the [senate warden] post." |
| Date | 13:18:09, February 28, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | "As I have explained; we are open to having a Senate Warden from another party, we merely wanted to outline why we opted for the Unionists to start. In terms of having more SDP representation; we recognise that the SDP has supported a Unionist Supreme Presidency and we are appreciative of that support. However we would be hesitant to grant an equity of seats to the smallest party; the RCS had less seats in the current cabinet as a result of having less seats. What we propose to compromise then; 4 to the CNP, 4 to the Unionists, 3 to the RCS and 2 to the SDP- stepped according to seat share. " Mykail Rafferty, Unionist leader (Supreme President) |
| Date | 22:32:15, February 28, 2015 CET | From | Coalition for National Unity [CNU] | To | Debating the Rafferty Ministry Debate (OOC: Vote for Archive) |
| Message | OOC: SENT TO VOTE FOR ROLEPLAY ARCHIVE |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||||
| yes | Total Seats: 0 | |||||
| no |
Total Seats: 425 | |||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: Make sure your nation casts its nominations in Particracy's very own Security Council elections! For more information, see http://forum.particracy.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=8453 |
| Random quote: "Let's not forget that we belong to history, that history that men and women who fought before did, that history that men and women who are fighting now will do." - Tera Pisthis, former Selucian politician |