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Bill: Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048
Details
Submitted by[?]: National Party of Luthori
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: September 4048
Description[?]:
| Mr. Speaker, We present the Imperial Diet with this motion to impose reasonable limitations on the noble class of Luthori. Currently they hold major rights, which is problematic as their influence grows more powerful than arguably the Imperial Prime Minister. Luthori should strive to promote a society based on merit and an overbearing noble class only serves to weaken that goal. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change Privileges of nobility (if nobility is recognised by the government).
Old value:: Nobility confers major rights, and can be hereditary.
Current: Nobility confers major rights, and can be hereditary.
Proposed: Nobility confers only titles and certain minor rights, but no political powers, and can be hereditary.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 21:21:16, June 22, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Democratic Party | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, As a party that has previously suggest placing more restrictions on the nobility, I have to ask the honorable member what role will the nobility play in the local governments? I Yield. |
| Date | 21:52:27, June 22, 2016 CET | From | Conservative Right | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr Speaker, This is not right! This goes against the traditon of our country. Why would the NPL go against the nobels when they have stood on their side before? Wilma Urquhart |
| Date | 23:06:17, June 22, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, Again we have this argument. How is that the Nobles have more power? They have checks on their power just like the democratic institutions have checks on theirs. You claim they are more powerful than the Imperial Prime Minister, and yet because of your rushed reforms, you have consolidated power into the position at both the Imperial and National levels, and all but eliminated any checks on the office besides the Emperor himself. Not to mention the contradictions those reforms have that we are (admittedly slowly [OOC: I will try to work more on them soon, work has been insane]) working to fix. The NPL has this notion that the nobles run the empire, but the fact of the matter is that it is a combination of both democratic and autocratic institutions that work in tandem with one another to ensure the empire is ruled by reason, intelligence, and pragmatism. The only thing this proposes is again another step backwards from restoring Luthori to her position as the one and only power in Terra. It is not for the sake of democracy that you propose this bill, but simply to clear another force standing in the way of the NPL's "rule by the mob" style of governance. A style, that would see the Emperor completely powerless, and this empire withdrawn from Terra, a mistake that brought ruin to Luthori before and will surely do so again. I yield. All Hail Luthori!!! |
| Date | 00:43:39, June 23, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, The honourable gentlemen from the IDP party raises reasonable concerns, but the role that nobility will play in local governments will be largely ceremonial in nature. There is already a elected Governor who will now have full legal authority behind it to act as the voice of the people. The ICU continue to present themselves like enemies of the crown, perhaps they may find themselves one day being officially labelled with that title. It would be a shame but progress demands this country move forward into the modern times. We, the Luthorian people, will not bend the knee to the nobility who spit upon the common man from their towers. |
| Date | 00:49:22, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Democratic Party | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, If it pleases the members of the NPL, please give examples of how the nobles are spitting on the common man from their towers? If we are to redefine their role, there offenses should be put out for all to see. I Yield. |
| Date | 00:53:41, June 23, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, It's a figure of speech but if you want examples then no need to look any further than the ICU who have once called members of this chambers "plebs." They don't respect us, and why should they if they dominate the political landscape. I yield. The Rt Hon. Isla Chamberlain Imperial Prime Minister |
| Date | 01:00:22, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Luthori Progressive Party | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Statement from the Luthori Progressive Party: The Luthori Progressive Party is rather surprised to see that the Luthorian People's Union is opposed to this bill. Is the LPU even a party of the people? |
| Date | 03:25:04, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, If the best example that the NPL can give of the nobility having too much power is the example of my grandfather calling other members"plebs," a man may I remind this chamber that is considered by not only the vast majority of monarchist in this empire, but the Emperor himself who was mentored and raised by him as the "Restorer of the Empire," then the NPL truely have no evidence to support their argument. If that is the example you can give them it just shows even more openly how desperate of a power grab this is. The IDM has indeed raised a good question, however the NPL is fiddling with facts to hide their true intentions. The governors as stated before already have immense powers and are, in effect, the Heads of Government at the duchy levels. The Grand Dukes (including the Prince of Orange) are more or less the Heads of State for the duchy levels. Do they have powers. Of course, but they are held in check and can be overruled by the governor's and the assemblies if the required vote is reached. This is the exact same as our other levels of government. As a Grand Duke myself, I can attest to that. Finally to address the charge that we are traitors to the crown: Hahaha, please Madam Prime Minister there is a place for jokes, but surely this is not one of them. We are simply against you and your predecessor:s attempts at gaining more power. Your party lied and pushed rushed reforms through once that caused chaos and have created legal contradictions that still cause issues. We will continue to oppose your party's attempts at putting Luthori back towards ruin. We hope our dear friends in the NPL awake from this madness that has plagued them now for two leaderships and again return to the reason led and pragmatic forces that caused our two parties to work so well together during the era of my grandfather, a man your party worked hand in hand to help restore much of this Empire. I yield. |
| Date | 04:38:16, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Democratic Party | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, If I can ask for clarification...what are the major rights the nobility currently posses? I yield |
| Date | 05:16:34, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Freeborn Luthorians/Freeborn Coalition | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | "Mr. Speaker" "The LPU will be officially revising its position on nobility, instead of preferring Noble-Bureaucrats that aren't heredity, we will support a complete abolition of the Nobles. The only reason we have supported the Nobility was in hopes of SOME shimmer of respect and solidarity form the Imperial Parties by which we has become more, and more in line with these passing years. We have seen none of this besides from the NPL, which we thank very much." James Huston LPU Leader |
| Date | 06:54:21, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, To answer the IDP, there is none that are outright uncountered by the non-nobility. We again also point out the merit based system of the nobility, with merchant nobility outranking the landed and the many commoners gaining rank and nobles losing it based on their work and behavior in such positions. I yield. |
| Date | 15:23:10, June 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Democratic Party | To | Debating the Curbing the Nobility Act of 4048 |
| Message | Mr. Speaker, With no clear evidence being presented that the current situation regarding the nobles is not working, I can only conclude that this change is not really in the best interest of the empire or needed. I will not need to be reminded that my party introduced a similar bill several years back during the formation of the Imperial Democratic Party and that as a party we are opposed to any rights that the nobles possess that are not countered by a democratic system. No evidence as been presented at this time to show that any rights are being granted that are not in fact countered by a merit based merchant nobility and a system in which the people have a strong voice in the government. The IDP stands opposed to outright autocracy and rule by nobility but the Empire is not in this state. Franz Von Valkenburg. IDP |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 277 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 331 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: Particracy does not allow real-life fictional references (eg. Gandalf, Harry Potter, Luke Skywalker). |
| Random quote: "Most politicians hold their fingers to the wind, and if we win we'll be showing them a lot of wind." - Ralph Nader |