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Bill: Bill for the abolition of torture.
Details
Submitted by[?]: Workers Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: July 2446
Description[?]:
| Currently, our law state that: "Suspects can only be tortured under grave emergencies where the information is vital." The Workers Party proposes it to be changed into: "Torture is never allowed." Luís Henrique - Secretary General, Workers Party |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The use of torture for obtaining information.
Old value:: Suspects can only be tortured under grave emergencies where the information is vital.
Current: It is at the discretion of the police officer to torture suspects for information.
Proposed: Torture is never allowed.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 22:54:14, August 21, 2007 CET | From |  Workers Party | To | Debating the Bill for the abolition of torture. |
| Message | It's long past the time that our polity gets rid of barbaric practices only fit for dictatorships, such as the use of torture to obtain information, either by the police or the Armed Forces. Gudrun Gonzales - President, Workers Party |
| Date | 21:53:56, August 22, 2007 CET | From | Workers Party | To | Debating the Bill for the abolition of torture. |
| Message | We see that the Federal Independent Party has voted against our proposal - though they are obviously unable to put down a single argument against it. François Hewington - Vice-President, Workers Party |
| Date | 04:45:47, August 23, 2007 CET | From | Federal Independent Party | To | Debating the Bill for the abolition of torture. |
| Message | First, Mr. Hewington, I like it how you've managed only to point out that we are voting against this while two other notable parties have done likewise. Secondly, it is up to Federal Independent Senators whether they wish to speak about the bill or not. We do not force our party to speak collectively as a whole if they do not want to engage in the routine debate, unlike your party. Third, your party is none such to speak about poor reasoning or neglect for debate. Your reasoning as to why we should vote in the affirmative is extremely generalized. It lists no solid reason as to why I as a Senator would wish to support the bill. Not only is your party's defense and argument for this bill generalized, it is very highly opinionated. Even if we as a whole did support this bill, we would not support it because of your argument but because of the values we believe in and live by. Fourth, attempting to bash my party, the colleagues I work with that make up this party, and insulting our values is earning your party zero respect from me. I cannot speak on the behalf of everyone, but I myself already do not like your approach to work bi-partisanly with another party. And for the record, there is no law stating that me and my colleagues from any party must take part in debate. And obviously, the people do not mind if we miss debate on occassional bills as it shows in our electoral history. Fifth, I personally support the method of torture. DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT attack my party as a whole if you disagree with it's decisions. Not everyone in this party agrees with one another, we are not slaves to this party's platform. Our platform is inclusive of every elected Senator's ideologies. The majority will factor in the highest to shape our party, but the minority is as powerful in influence. More than a few times in our history has the minority of this party led the direction in which we take. I would normally debate should a representative from a party question the direction we've taken, but only if they ask politely and politically correctly. If not, this party has a policy in which I totally agree with, and that is to ignore any who can't muster up the curteousy to be polite, be bi-partisan in its words, and to show respect in its actions. Should those simple guidelines be vacated by a party then we will not support active interaction with them. Hopefully, in the future, an understanding between our two parties will be formed. But for now, I remain un-impressed. FIP Minority Whip Vedrin Levish (Liberal Coalition) |
| Date | 15:34:23, August 23, 2007 CET | From | Conservative Party of Solentia | To | Debating the Bill for the abolition of torture. |
| Message | (OOC: In his defense, you were the only major party to have voted nay at the time he wrote that. I voted afterward, and so did LPS.) |
| Date | 01:25:43, August 24, 2007 CET | From | Workers Party | To | Debating the Bill for the abolition of torture. |
| Message | Comrade François is one of our best polemicists. And yes, he is snarky. But, besides the point raised by the Conservatives, that the FIP was the only party to have voted when François posted his message, there is another good reason that he singled the Federal Independents: they are the party of the Supreme President, and as so they play a unique role in Solentian politics. The other issue is that our country remains as one of those backwards semi-democracies that still allow the use of torture by the police. Yes, we know - only in "exceptional" cases. But since it is the police who determines what is exceptional and what is not, our common citizens are always at risk of becoming "exceptions" themselves. That should come to an end, and the Workers Party will pursue it relentlessly. Gudrun Gonzales - Chairwoman, Workers Party (We are mostly a party of immigrants, as our names perhaps denounce. Sometimes we get Solentian wrong. We are however adapting to the national terminology; hence the change in my position's name, from "president" to "chairwoman" |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 0 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 280 | ||||
| abstain |
Total Seats: 36 |
| Random fact: In general, role-play requires the consent of all players. |
| Random quote: "Fascism is capitalism plus murder." - Upton Sinclair |