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Bill: Free schools
Details
Submitted by[?]: Cooperative Commonwealth Federation
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: June 2114
Description[?]:
| Public education for all shall be restored, but schools shall be permitted to do whatever they like, in order to create the maximum possible diversity in education. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The education system.
Old value:: Education is private, but the government issues vouchers to pay for the schooling of disadvantaged children.
Current: There is a free public education system and a small number of private schools, which are heavily regulated to ensure they teach adequate skills and information.
Proposed: There is a free public education system alongside private schools.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 22:07:37, September 19, 2005 CET | From |  Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Our education system is already free, but we will not endorse article 2 either |
| Date | 23:27:51, September 19, 2005 CET | From | Cooperative Commonwealth Federation | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Free, as in "free to to whatever they like." |
| Date | 16:03:15, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Royal Conservative Party | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | But they are free to do as they like under the current value of Article 2, as they can choose whether to enforce prayer or not. I am not terribly in favour of religion being pushed on schools but then again I am not entirely in favour of secularism being pushed onto schools so the current value is fine. The problem with the current value of Article One is that it only allows us to give vouchers to the disadvantaged. I personally think that a voucher system is best for all people, not just the poor. However this option is not available and so I am inclined to support the proposed value of Article One. |
| Date | 16:54:03, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | TiC would prefer to treat citizens the same regardless of wealth. A voucher system for all would accomplish this, or else no voucher system. However, the voucher system is tied to economic favoritism, I'll ask for another option... |
| Date | 19:12:11, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Cooperative Commonwealth Federation | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | OK, splitting the bill into two. The public ed propsoal goes to a vote, and the religion one to a new bill. |
| Date | 19:22:12, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | I would like to note that this bill removes absolute school choice from many parents. They can no longer choose any school they wish, but are limited in budget to public schools. |
| Date | 22:24:25, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Cooperative Commonwealth Federation | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | As opposed to the current voucher system, which gives choice to the wealthy, and to the poor (barring structural barriers and other invisible costs such as schoolbooks and uniforms at some schools), but none to the middle classes. We might even consider a universal voucher system, since our vision of education is certainly one that allows maximum choice in schools, but the current value is just not a fair or viable way to run education. This is a case where legislators need to be pragmatic, rather than idealistic, in order to give our children the best possible system. |
| Date | 22:50:40, September 20, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | ((The universal voucher system has been proposed to the forum, I will ask Wegason to add it next time I talk with him, and propose a bill for it when it is implemented.)) As you know from other bills, TiC opposes giving government favoritism to any, and while we prefer a voucher system, the income-requirement clause has always irked us. For now, we hope that we can interpret the current law to be funding for those who cannot readily afford to fund themselves-including the middle class. The choice offered by the voucher system is what we want to preserve, which is why we will oppose this bill and request that the RCP does so as well. |
| Date | 23:23:00, September 20, 2005 CET | From | National People's Gang | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Do vouchers cover the costs of children travelling to the school of their choice? Are vouchers available for term-time accommodation if they choose boarding schools or schools too far to commute? |
| Date | 02:08:57, September 21, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Schools can be expected to provide transportation as it greatly expands their customer base |
| Date | 02:59:07, September 21, 2005 CET | From | Royal Conservative Party | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | "Do vouchers cover the costs of children travelling to the school of their choice? Are vouchers available for term-time accommodation if they choose boarding schools or schools too far to commute?" Does having a 'free' public school system avoid the problems of travel and uniform costs? No, it doesn't. It only covers the education itself, just as the vouchers do for the poor. The fundamental difference between the two schemes is that if you have a public school system, it has to be funded by tax payers who may not wish to send their children to public schools and therefore they are effectively paying twice for education, once in taxation and once in private school fees. If will vote no for the mean time but I hope most sincerly that an all-inclusive voucher system is introduced soon. |
| Date | 03:24:44, September 21, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Wegason seems to support it on the forum, he basically is just waiting for other support(I think). Also, he just implemented several proposals, and may be taking a break |
| Date | 16:31:33, September 21, 2005 CET | From | Cooperative Commonwealth Federation | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | RCP, the proposals were only split becuase you said you supported universal free education. The best course might be to support this proposal and then the universal vouchers one later, if and when it is implemented. There's no guarantee that it will be. Public schools will be paid by taxes. Vouchers will be paid by taxes. So I'm unsure what you mean by "if you have a public school system, it has to be funded by tax payers who may not wish to send their children to public schools and therefore they are effectively paying twice for education, once in taxation and once in private school fees." Surely the issue here is finding a way to get free education to the middle classes? Dipping into real life, it sounds to me as if you think the people who send their children to Rugby or Harrow or Eton should not have to pay taxes for education: is that really what you think? |
| Date | 19:05:41, September 21, 2005 CET | From | Tuesday Is Coming | To | Debating the Free schools |
| Message | Those that choose to send their children to private schools must pay the private school fees, and the taxes for the public schools. Vouchers take care of this problem, and prevent a situation where someone pays for the same thing twice. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 139 | |||||
| no |
Total Seats: 161 | |||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
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