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Bill: Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori
Details
Submitted by[?]: Liberale Partij (L)
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: September 2590
Description[?]:
| The Hutori Liberal-Royalist Party has accepted the outcome of the last civil war. Peace, above all else, is our priority. However, we do take issue with some of the reforms that have been passed by the Confederate armies in the wake of their victory. We accept the new constitutional order, but we also believe in an inherent right to speak for democratic change on behalf of those voters who might not agree with some elements of the new order. Take, for example, the name of our great nation: Athlorcaea We have -great- respect for the efforts of the Confederation, but this a-historical name sounds more like an obscure medical term. A dangerous disease, perhaps. Our school children, and even some of our politicians, have difficulty spelling it. We, as a nation, ought to show that we have moved beyond our gruesome past with our actions - not by trying to put uncomfortable new labels on old barrels. We therefore propose that our country be named "Republic of Hutori", leaving all other Confederate reforms intact. |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 08:14:10, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | We believe it is important to have this debate. We don't expect to get a two-thirds majority for this immediately, but we're curious where parties stand on this issue. |
| Date | 08:24:47, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Democratic Socialist Union | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | You ought to be ashamed of yourself. The only reason you are here, good sir, is because we fought this war. How dare you be such an ungrateful person? |
| Date | 12:40:50, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | The Hutori Liberal-Royalist Party has been loyal opposition in the Confederation, and voters -have- trusted us with a leading role in the government of this nation time and again since the first Confederate elections. To accuse the party is to accuse the millions of voters in Kenaii, Roccato and Falristan who have voted for a Liberal-Royalist. As such, we respect the position of the People's Revolutionary Communist Party. However, our democratic obligations are to our voters, not to other political parties. Would you prefer these citizens turn again to a new incarnation of the Hutori Conservative parties? |
| Date | 14:09:09, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | We are very glad that this bill came into existence, if it wasn't you, we would have done it. The Confederation is no more, so there is no reason to keep this name. Especially since Hutori and all other names changed in order to 'forget the past'. If we really want to forget the past, our country's name should indeed not have 'Confederate' in it. And you, PRCP, of all people, should understand that this conservative, traditional thinking lies at the very base of our last civil war. It must accur to you that the confederation, or the 'alliance between two parties and a - so called - betrayer party', is dead, and Athlorcaea took in its place. |
| Date | 16:16:43, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Oh wait .. We didn't see the title. Why ban Athlorcaea? If only 'Confederate' was left out we'd be all the happier. |
| Date | 16:57:56, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | We don't mind taking Confederation out, but how DARE you tell us to our faces that you want this glorious country to go BACK to the way it was, in any way at all, symbolically of literally! Athlorcaea symbolizes freedom and progress; Hutori symbolizes oppression and elitism. |
| Date | 16:58:50, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | OOC Athlorcaea sounds WAY cooler than Hutori. |
| Date | 17:12:42, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Right. Anyone besides us who want to go back to the old name? We're not going to support this policy if nobody else does. "Democratic Republic" sounds like a recipe for disaster though. Just like the "most serene Kingdom" was a warzone turned nuclear wasteland. If we're sticking with this... medical condition... for a name, at least we ought to define ourselves properly. |
| Date | 18:24:25, June 10, 2008 CET | From |  Folks Revolusjonær Kommunistiske Parti | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Well, you're all still traitors. Those who would want to change the name, that is. |
| Date | 18:25:46, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | What is this foreign speak I hear?! |
| Date | 18:27:47, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Folks Revolusjonær Kommunistiske Parti | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Yeah I thought you wouldn't understand. It's what us people call "wisdom". |
| Date | 18:34:25, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | OOC: Look who's back.. :P I propose the simplicity of 'Athlorcaea'. Just like a foreign party said, it is allowed to have just the country's name as an official name, and this way it doesn't label us like every other country. |
| Date | 19:01:08, June 10, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | I kinda like the FGGP's idea. Athlorcaea. |
| Date | 05:14:33, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | The Family and Tradition Party finds it interesting that the communists have abandoned the country they once attempted to claim for themselves. A very interesting developement indeed. It appears as though our predictions as the HCC had been correct afterall - a communist government can never stand, and its poor, hapless subjects will eventually reject it. The communists have been driven out of Hutori, back into the dark swamps from which they arose, into exile. This is very good news indeed. We urge the remaining parties of Hutori to repeal and roll-back all of the damage that this communist infestation has caused. We urge them to seperate government from any abstract notions of 'equality' and 'egalitarianism'; stop the managerial statecraft that the communists have been so adament to impliment; give back as much power as possible to the local governments. The Union may not have won the civil war, but as shown, the communists weren't completely safe in their position of power following their victory; evidently, they got too comfortable and were soon ousted by the people, and now they have fled. Finally, a true victory for Hutori. The people of Hutori have earned it, for their endurance and patience, and their ability to see right from wrong; communism is always, always wrong. |
| Date | 05:22:37, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Though, we do notice the emergence of a new communist party, masquerading under the holy cloak of Christianity. We urge the other parties to prevent communism in Hutori, lest another revolution occurs - never let it take hold; never let it infect the country again. |
| Date | 05:23:02, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | OOC They got bored. Gtfo. |
| Date | 05:23:54, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Oh, we're masquerading? Or could it be that true Christianity IS communism, and you are too blind to see it? |
| Date | 07:40:07, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Christianity isn't communism - in fact, it's one of the best protections AGAINST communism. Why do you think Marx called religion the 'opiate of the masses'? Why have all of the most oppressive, totalitarian regimes sought to either control or eliminate religion, in the fear that it might undermine their absolute control over the people? Communists worry that if people believe in God, they may not be so willing to believe unconditionally in the state. They may not be willing to submit totally to the government if they share their loyalty to God. The state is the one thing, and the one thing only, that communists want the people to worship. The church is one of society's most valuable strongholds against communism. Never in the bible did Christ say that it is appropriate to steal from the rich to give to the poor - charity is most definately an admirable thing, and is certainly a tenet of the Christian faith, but organized wealth re-distribution. It is important to recognize that the bible values giving to the poor ONLY as a voluntary act of kindness, and this is the way it should remain. Certainly, the bible condones egalitarianism in the sense that everyone is equal before God, but the equality advocated by communism is an equality of an entirely different form. |
| Date | 10:06:32, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Athlorcaean Liberal Party (R) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Personally I would even let the democratic fall and go for Republic of Hutori. As irony would have it when a country is Democratic in name it is not so in reality. I don't really get why this is a sore point the Republic of Hutori would not lead to the same malpractices of "elitists" (funny concept btw) known under the Most Serene etc. Hutori, laws have been passed reforms made and lets face it our current name is unpronounceable |
| Date | 11:43:11, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | This proposal has been adjusted to be in in line with the preferences of the Royalist faction in our party, and it will now be brought to a vote! |
| Date | 15:19:07, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | No. We don't want 'Hutori' back, and if 'Democracy has to be dropped, everything has to be dropped! And to the FAT party, please shut up? The left wing still is alive in this country, and the war fought didn't have the least to do with communism, stop thinking that! It was a war against the monarchy. It fell in the beginning of the century, but after 30 years it was reinstalled, and the people cound not have this so they started a civil war. Stop trying to make this your 'anti-communism campaign'. |
| Date | 16:02:01, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | 1. Yes, the Confederation never was really "Communist", so stop that. 2. We obviously don't follow Marxist communism! We support the wealth re-distribution aspects of communism, but not the practice of elimination of religion. FFS, could you not interpret that from the name of our party? 3. God doesn't want charity to be a petty act of kindness. God wants organized egalitarianism. "And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God." - Matthew 19:24 It's quite obvious I won't be able to convince you, but Christianity is Communism in its truest form of practice. Accept that you follow an extremely corrupted form of Christianity, or just go away. |
| Date | 17:36:52, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Athlorcaean Liberal Party (R) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | "God wants organized egalitarianism." Must say I never looked at it that way, but strangely enough (with my limited knowledge of religion) it does kind of make sense. Though the old testament God was kind off ruthless in achieving it, if I remember correctly he " smithed" an awfull lot of people ;-P |
| Date | 17:46:34, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | OOC Yeah, those are the parts you don't read in Sunday school XD |
| Date | 18:04:38, June 11, 2008 CET | From | Liberale Partij (L) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | God wants egalitarianism, but the people want FREEDOM! [TM]. And they want it now. Served with mayonnaise. The Liberal-Royalist Party is the McDonalds of the peoples. Freedom now, fast! Long live the Hutori Republic! |
| Date | 04:25:55, June 12, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | We beseech the Future Generation Green Party that they no longer refer to us as the 'FAT party', but rather as the 'FTP', if acronym is necessary. We feel that the FGGP has deliberately given us this derogatory title, as they have an axe to grind with our party, the former HCC. Furthermore, whilst the war was claimed on behalf of the 'republic', this was merely a vehicle for communism; a convenient catalyst for the communist party to achieve its iron grip on Hutori, and to enforce its abstract notions of 'equality' and tyrranical centralized government. The war may have officially been declared in the name of a 'republic', but we assert, with absolute conviction, that communism was the underlying motivation for the unlawful destruction of the monarchy. Communism comes in many forms, each as ugly as the next. For the cunning communists of Hutori, the form was 'republic'. ...and no, we will not shut up. |
| Date | 05:22:10, June 12, 2008 CET | From | Folks Revolusjonær Kommunistiske Parti | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Communism was indeed the underlying motivation for the destruction of the monarchy, and might I add that our crusade was quite succesful. We never meant, however, to install a communist dictatorship. We meant to install, reinstall for that matter, the Republic, and we did. We did not take any steps towards making our party the only legal one. |
| Date | 13:52:56, June 12, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | Can we please bury what lies in the past? And we don't see what's so derogatory about FAT? No one cared back when the FGGP started the FAGS! organisation during the war. :P Fat people are fun even, they enjoy life more! I'd go even further: we love fat people (at least as long as they don't eat meat)! OOC: The bill in favour of 'Athlorcaea' got passed by the way, the majority voted yes. I propose we drop the old values and let Athlorcaea be the new name. We already have a new wiki, a new forum thread and new city names. We'll just have to decide once and for all how it's pronounced officially (I though it was [athlorsy]?), and stop the quarreling. The war is over dudes! Cheer up and agree. :-) |
| Date | 18:27:57, June 12, 2008 CET | From | Christian Communist Front | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | FAT, your mindless anti-Communist blabbering isn't contributing to the human race at all. As for the name, somebody will need to go to the forums and request the other name change as it got far more support. BTW the way I pronounce it as "Ath-Lore-Kay-Uh". |
| Date | 20:58:07, June 12, 2008 CET | From | Groene ArbeidersPartij | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | We posted a request in the forum thread. A"thlorkayuh" sounds fine by me. |
| Date | 03:41:22, June 13, 2008 CET | From | Family and Tradition Party (disbanded) | To | Debating the Constitutional Reform: Republic of Hutori |
| Message | OOC: I was mainly joking about that FAT thing :P |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||
| yes | Total Seats: 51 | |||
| no | Total Seats: 16 | |||
| abstain |
Total Seats: 89 |
| Random fact: Character names must appear plausible and should consist of at least a first name and a surname. Exceptions to this will only be granted at Moderation's discretion and where a very strong case has been presented |
| Random quote: "If a female president can come here and be treated equally, why can't any other woman?" - Jewell C. Stillman, former Lourennais politician (on equal rights in Badara) |