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Bill: 5
Details
Submitted by[?]: New Socialist Left Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: October 2593
Description[?]:
| The workers of cildania are sick of explotation! |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The government's policy towards daily working hours.
Old value:: The government has no policy concerning daily working hours.
Current: The government obligates trade unions and employers to negotiate the daily number of working hours.
Proposed: Daily working hours are regulated by the government.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 16:05:30, June 17, 2008 CET | From |  Progressive Liberal Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | We already objected to a similar proposal, and we reaffirm ourselves that daily working hours are a matter of negotiation between the employer and the employee. At most, the government should set a cap on it - like 12 hours per day - and prosecute offenders as slavers. |
| Date | 16:12:25, June 17, 2008 CET | From | Cildanian Nationalist Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | Agreed. Working hours should be set by contracts between unions and employers. |
| Date | 18:04:25, June 17, 2008 CET | From | New Socialist Left Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | " like 12 hours per day " are you stupid or what? Has someone of your party worked once? Do you know what it is to work 12hours per day ? What should our citizens be? Slaves? Have they just the right to sleep eat and work? Are you against social life? |
| Date | 19:39:17, June 17, 2008 CET | From | Progressive Liberal Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | We members of the PLP perfectly KNOW that the NORMAL working day should be around 8 hours, but we were talking of setting a _hard maximum_ that would cover for necessities like medical guards etc. that can sometimes work for more than 8 hours a day. Above that maximum, the employer would be committing a criminal offense, and in particular we think they should be charged with SLAVERY. PS: Honorable non-Senators from the NSLP should watch their language or risk being expelled off the floor by the Speaker. |
| Date | 23:47:00, June 17, 2008 CET | From | New Socialist Left Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | Yes yes your speach is very nice, but demagogic, we know well wath the employers do when there are no restrictions and workers right, for our party the rights of our citizens and of our workers are above all, we know it well that your party see its complety different... Just let the economy role... let the rest go his way... that is what defines a popular and a serious party. |
| Date | 00:27:03, June 18, 2008 CET | From | Progressive Liberal Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | We do not directly oppose a regulation of the _maximum_ number of working hours, we just think that it would be better if the parties that will eventually sign the contract get the opportunity to decide for themselves instead of being forced to do what the government deems "better for them". The State is the guarantee of the Rule of Law, not a paternalist overmind. Besides, the regulation of work hours does not directly affect workers' pays, since the federal regulations set a minimum wage _per hour_. |
| Date | 01:56:39, June 18, 2008 CET | From | New Socialist Left Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | We arent talking about the payment or about the salary, we think that the State should impose a maximum of daily working hours, we don't see the State as a paternalist institution, we know that the liberals or neoliberals (or neoconservatives) see it like that, we stand for the defense of those who really develop our country. For your party the State shouldnt exist, the market would treat everyone equal... We know that the reality isn't so... So the State must defend the majority.... the workers... If you think that the restriction of maximum hours of daily work is a paternalist atitute from the State, you would sit right in the Bush's american administration... We Socialists have since ever defended the workers right and we know what the right wing and the borgoise wants... free mark and no workers right :) Only a socialist State is progressive, only socialist polycis defend the will of the majority ! There is only poverty, exploitation, war etc... in the world, as long people like your rulling worlds policy. Why don't you create the Bilderberg or the Mason club of Particracy? (or Opus Dei) |
| Date | 05:56:50, June 18, 2008 CET | From | Progressive Liberal Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | Such incendiary speech... We're sure you realize that Marx, Engels and Bakunin are long dead; and so are their mindchildren Lenin, Stalin and Mao. We all know how their experiments turned out: less freedom, millions sent to reeducation-through-work camps, etc. Did you listen to our speech? We don't, again DON'T oppose the regulation of a _maximum_ number of daily hours (which is NOT what's written in this proposal). However, we'd _prefer_ it to state that the government encourages workers and employers to negotiate working hours, with the additional clause that a maximum of X hours per day is not to be surpassed. Since you seem to have the wrong opinion of the PLP, check our voting history and you'll see that we're compromised with a SANE welfare state that provides a safety net for people, but which doesn't unnecessarily curtail their freedom. By the way, thinking that you know what "workers" want and that only you defend the will of the majority is a very bold opinion - usually people claiming to know what others want have become either barmen or dictators. Which one are you headed to? |
| Date | 13:52:21, June 18, 2008 CET | From | New Socialist Left Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | Our party likes so much Stalin Mao Enver Hoxha Ho Chi Minh like your party likes Hitler Franco Salazar Mussolini and G. Bush. We knew that your party has limited social visions, but that they would be such big, is for us a enormous surprise. Your Party is ultra demagogic, you say you arent against this ACT but you vote no.... you liberals are all the same... "yes we can" LOL! |
| Date | 14:45:34, June 18, 2008 CET | From | Progressive Liberal Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | We are not directly against this act, we just believe that are far better options. If that were little on its own, then your brilliant rhetoric finally pushes us to the "no" side. About the dictator references, we did not fully understand you. We're sure you mean that _neither_ of our party like dictatorships, but we'd like you to confirm such an interpretation. About demagogy, well, what can we say to a party that purports itself as the "the only one defending the will of the majority". You extremists only like the will of the majority if it matches with _your_ will. In opposition, we liberals respect the will of the majority no matter how wrong we think it is, because the right to be wrong is also a human right. If it were for us, we'd have 150 seats in this Senate and implement a liberal welfare state, but seemingly "the will of the majority" does not back us, so we respect it and try to influence decisions with whatever power we have. Last but not least, regarding our "limited social vision", we invite you one again to check our voting history - you might be in for a surprise. |
| Date | 00:28:17, June 19, 2008 CET | From | New Socialist Left Party | To | Debating the 5 |
| Message | Our party likes Stalin and Mao so much as your party likes Hitler Mussolini... understood? For your party the STATE shouldn't even exist ! C'mon you could be a little bit more progressive than futsyama... What matters your voting history if you in this act vote no!? Your Party also defends the will of the majority.... of the powerful/employers... When there aren't more political arguments against socialists, you call us just extremists... this tactic is so older than Kissinger! |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 61 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 114 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: When elections in a country are held, all bills in the voting phase are reset to the debate phase. |
| Random quote: "A son can bear with equanimity the loss of his father, but the loss of his inheritance may drive him to despair." - Niccolo Machiavelli |