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Bill: Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias
Details
Submitted by[?]: Protectorate Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: February 2124
Description[?]:
| Church leaders provide a necessary component of insuring the smooth running of a society. Religions provide the morals needed for civilized persons to live together, and therefore we should support all reconginzed religions and allow them the freedom to use their money toward helping their fellow man. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change Remuneration of ministers of religion.
Old value:: The state does not intervene in the remuneration of ministers of religion.
Current: The state does not intervene in the remuneration of ministers of religion.
Proposed: The salaries and pensions of ministers of religion shall be borne by the state and regulated by the law.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 07:05:48, October 07, 2005 CET | From | Social Republican Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | Atheists should pay for ministers of religion.... why? If people desire hierarchy in their faith, let them bear the weight. |
| Date | 15:24:42, October 07, 2005 CET | From |  Protectorate Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | The same reason the healthy are paying for the care of the sick, the same reason the wealthy pay for the housing and the food for the less fortunate. |
| Date | 17:24:24, October 07, 2005 CET | From | Malivia Democratic Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | It seems to me this is a step towards Government endorsement of religions, by paying their salaries. Bad idea. |
| Date | 20:24:38, October 07, 2005 CET | From | Protectorate Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | Why is the government supprort of an organization which is dedicated toward helping others, promoting a code of conduct which makes it easier to live in society a bad idea? |
| Date | 20:25:58, October 07, 2005 CET | From | Social Republican Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | But rich people used to be poor, and being poor is a disadvantage. Few people choose to be poor. Being sick is not a choice either - having a heirarchal religion is though. |
| Date | 23:21:05, October 07, 2005 CET | From | Malivia Democratic Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | Because not all religions are dedicated towards helping others. Some are guised under that idea, but actually are self-serving organizations. Also, do we want the government to promote conflicting sets of morals? The malivian government may just form its own religion, demanding worship of a particular person. A line needs to be drawn between the charity aspect of a religion, and the religious aspect, and the PPs bill here erases that line. |
| Date | 02:08:22, October 08, 2005 CET | From | Protectorate Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | As stated we will only support those religions recognized by the government. This would require the religion not be a self-serving organization, as the MDP expressed concern over. What conflicting morals are we promoting? The moral of not killing others seems follow the line our government takes, or the one about aiding those in need also runs parallel to the governmental concerns. Why would the government form its own religion? As for the parallels between religion and other social services. It is about helping those who need it. We offer job training programs for medical doctors. Do we require every citizen to become a medical doctor? no. Instead we offfer the service for those who desire it. Similarly, we support the practice of an organized religion for those who wish it. Why do we support the training of medical doctors? To aid those wishing to contribute more to society. Religion does the same. Thus we should support it. |
| Date | 13:17:30, October 08, 2005 CET | From | Malivia Democratic Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | What about a religion whose morals are opposed to same sex weddings? Or opposed to women serving in the military? |
| Date | 16:23:13, October 09, 2005 CET | From | Protectorate Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | Religions which offer radically different beliefs which are contrary to the accepted practice of Malivia and denounce the rights of others to live in this way will not be recognized by the state. Thus we would not support their leaders. Rather only religions which stress peaceful coexistence will be supported. |
| Date | 22:08:14, October 09, 2005 CET | From | Malivia Democratic Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | Again, the MDP opposes this bill on the principle that paying the salaries of ministers is endorsement of that religion. If we are to have a certain degree of separation of church and state, we can't pass this bill. |
| Date | 01:24:12, October 10, 2005 CET | From | LibCom Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | I've said it before and I'll say it again: No to antidisestablishmentarianism. |
| Date | 16:24:49, October 10, 2005 CET | From | Social and Labour Reform Party | To | Debating the Establishing the Recognition of Ecclesias |
| Message | The government has no business supporting or promoting any religion; religion is a personal matter for the individual, not for the government. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 19 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 46 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 35 |
| Random fact: There are two countries based on Egypt in the game. Cobura is based on modern Egypt with a retro twist, while Hawu Mumenhes is based on Ancient Egypt with a modernist twist. |
| Random quote: "We cannot acknowledge allegiance to any human government... Our country is the world, our countrymen are all mankind." - William Lloyd Garrison |