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Bill: OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali
Details
Submitted by[?]: Uniao Socialista
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: July 3751
Description[?]:
| I propose the following: The people of Tukarali are a mix of Gao-Showan origin and Baltusian/Gaduridan settlers who came in Tukarali many ages ago,some before recorded time.The ethnic composition of Tukarali is: Tukarin (native Tukarali population of Gao-Showan origin) 65% Tukaryan (Baltusian speaking population) 15% Mixed Tukarin/Tukaryan 15% Other (Aldegarian mostly) 5% The naming of characters should be a mix of Baltusian(Portuguese) and Gao-Showan(Japanese) names. Or just one of the languages.Most people prefer Baltusian which is easier after so many centuries and it is kind of the "state" language. Religion Hosianism: 30% Kanzoism: 40% Yazdean:10% Ahmadism:8% Atheists/Non-Religious:5% Yeudism 2% Other:5% |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 07:38:24, October 06, 2014 CET | From | União Democrática do Tukarali | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | OOC: Good effort, but I would like to keep Tukarese as an overall name for all the people of Tukarali, as it has been used before and I have always used it. In the wiki, the "European" upper class has been referred to as Tukaryan, maybe we could keep it that way, or a variation thereof. I also don't think that the language barrier between the ethnic groups is quite as strict as proposed here. I've always thought of most of my politicians as having "Asian" origins but using "Portuguese" names and language. And, incidentally, the UDT has never been an exclusively upper class party (Anyway, I don't think that any specific party should be referred to the the final renewed cultural protocols. My party has been quite long-lived, but hopefully the protocols would be in force for longer than I may stay here). |
| Date | 10:42:07, October 06, 2014 CET | From | Uniao Socialista | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Well I must say I did not expect that. It's surprisingly good news that you actually support my idea.The above is only "work in progress" the very basics of a Cultural Protocol. What about the religion part? do you have any objections there? -this is obviously all OOC no need to put OOC in front of your posts :) About the Tukarese/Tukarin: I want to make this diversification because of the language issue that has been an issue for a long time(remember the previous debate with Aynako?).Of course no party will be mentioned in the final document.Again this is only an early version |
| Date | 15:20:26, October 06, 2014 CET | From | União Democrática do Tukarali | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Well, putting OOC before my post was somewhat semi-automatic ... I have no objection to making a distinction between the Gao-Showan and the Baltusian, but I don't think that the use of Portuguese has been an upper class minority phenomenon restricted to ethnic Baltusians. The use of Portuguese has been widely adopted across all sections of society (which isn't to say that many people might not still use Japanese/Gao-Showan in private surroundings). Also, the term "Tukarese" has traditionally been used for the "people of of the nation of Tukarali", not to a particular ethnicity like in this somewhat outdated wiki-entry: http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Tukarese . I've always used it with that meaning, so I wouldn't like it to refer to Baltusian-origin people only. That's why I suggested to recycle Tukaryan, but I'm open to other suggestions. I have no problems with or objections to your ideas about religion. |
| Date | 18:52:59, October 06, 2014 CET | From | Uniao Socialista | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Made a slight change from "Tukarese" to "Tukaryan".Of course I wait a response from Aynako |
| Date | 23:34:22, October 06, 2014 CET | From | Aliança Real de Tukarali 👑 | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Based on the previous cultural protocols and what has happened since then I would expect the Baltusian speaking population to be mainly ethinic Baltusians and the upper class natives, perhaps 20% of the population. I would expect Ethnic Baltusians to make up 15% of the population. Also, My proposals for religion: Hosianism: 20% Kanzoism: 51% Yazdean:10% Ahmadism:9% Atheists:5% Other:5% |
| Date | 07:36:58, October 07, 2014 CET | From | União Democrática do Tukarali | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Given the preeminence of Portuguese which has lasted for several centuries now, I don't think that there's a reason to assume that only such a small proportion of the population actually speaks that language. It may have started as a language of the upper class, but, after all, it has been the language of advancement for all that time, and it's not as if people, especially the middle classes, wouldn't be pragmatic about it. So, while I can see that etnic Baltusians really may only make up between 15 and 20% of the population, I would assume that a majority of the population actually speaks Portuguese. Many Gao-Showans would probably be bilingual, with some of them only having a nostalgic relationship with their original native language, some of them being truly bilingual, and others simply having a working command of Portuguese but speaking Japanese in their everyday lives. |
| Date | 14:19:08, October 07, 2014 CET | From | Uniao Socialista | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | So while we discuss about the ethnic composition,let's press the religion matter.Granted,the Kanzo faith must be strong but I think Hosianism should be bigger to allow Kanzo "cultists"(extreme religious groups) to surface making way for interesting RP. If you wish to see Kanzo as dominant faith I'm fine with it,just tried to make a juicy RP out of this :P |
| Date | 21:18:01, October 07, 2014 CET | From | Aliança Real de Tukarali 👑 | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | As recognized by Moderation the country is still Gao-Showan, while Baltusian influence is all well and good a massive swing to the majority speaking Baltusian and becoming Hosians doesn't exactly fit with that. |
| Date | 06:50:22, October 08, 2014 CET | From | Uniao Socialista | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Religion changes made.I think 25% is a good percentage for upper class & bureaucrats,and maybe we could add a very small Aldegarian minority? Like 3% of the population? to justify the Yazdean faith |
| Date | 06:56:06, October 08, 2014 CET | From | União Democrática do Tukarali | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | I've always thought of most of my politicians as being Gao-Showan but speaking Portuguese. Portuguese has been the predominant political language for several centuries (and it wasn't me who introduced it). Having the language declared a minority phenomenon now would de facto retcon most of the history of the Democratic Republic, which has existed for several centuries, to have been an oligarchic regime of the upper classes. What's so difficult about accepting that people are Gao-Showan but using another language that has been gradually adopted over several centuries? I'm not suggesting that Japanese has died out completely, and there is always potential for a revival. And as for religion: Kanzo was orinally introduced as a political religion. With it not having been actively promoted by the state for several centuries, a decline in adherents is to be expected, though possibly not quite to the low level of 31%. How about switching the proposed numbers (40% Kanzo, 31% Hosian)? |
| Date | 20:53:52, October 08, 2014 CET | From | Partido Republicano Tukarêse | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | I've been playing this game on and off for about 2 years and I didn't know about the country's Gao-Showan origins up until now because Portuguese is the only language I've seen being used in Tukarali all this time. That said, UDT's opinion sounds pretty reasonable to me. In the real world, we see, for example, many Native American tribes who have ultimately adopted the language of the dominant classes, like English in the U.S. and Portuguese in Brazil, so it wouldn't be illogical if a similar phenomenon took place in Tukarali. And from that perspective, the same can be applied with regard to the religion... As a matter of fact I'd suggest 31% Kanzo and 40% Hosian. |
| Date | 19:47:10, October 09, 2014 CET | From | Aliança Real de Tukarali 👑 | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Sorry, I guess I have been rather narrow minded here. The country is Gao-Showan but you are correct, the use of Portugese does not obstruct that, providing that Japanese has a strong role as a second language here. My aims are basically to make sure that it is recognized that this nation has a Gao-Showan culture and the ability to RP with other Gao-Showan nations. I'd prefer 43% Kanzo, 28% Hosian, |
| Date | 00:33:54, October 14, 2014 CET | From | Jebhe Melli Aldegār | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | Friendly greetings from neighboring Aldegar. Hope it's ok if I butt in on this conversation. Just wanted to point out that although the Tukarese are considered Gao-Showa, they are not Japanese. The Gao-Showa group is a metaethnicity that largely corresponds to RL East Asians, and the Tukarese, while belonging to the group, have been represented more as a combination between Indonesians and Filipinos (http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Tukarese). There is also supposed to be a sizable Mongol minority in Tukarali (http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Mu-Tze), as well as a large number of Kunihito (http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Kunihito) people. As for Kanzo, I talked to Zhou/Zongxian, the initial creator of the religion, and he gave me permission to modify it slightly by introducing some Manichaean and Buddhist elements, to make it fit better with the cultural context on the continent; I'll get on the modifications soon enough. That being considered, although Kanzo started as a political religion, slowly evolved into a mainstream religion, so it can retain its position as the dominant faith in Tukarali without the need to make Hosianism dominant (http://particracy.wikia.com/wiki/Kanzo). Hope this all makes sense, and sorry for the intrusion. |
| Date | 07:14:03, October 19, 2014 CET | From | Central Democratic Party | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | It looks a good idea to mix those kind of names, Portuguese and Gao-Showan, but Ive made all the members of my party with only Brazilian/Portuguese-like names, and Im not sure I should change it or keep it to make realistic.. |
| Date | 12:49:11, October 30, 2014 CET | From | Uniao Socialista | To | Debating the OOC: Cultural Protocols for Tukarali |
| Message | I'm putting it to vote I would love it if everyone voted for these,I spend a good deal of time trying to compromise with everyone! |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||
| yes | Total Seats: 68 | |||
| no | Total Seats: 0 | |||
| abstain | Total Seats: 57 |
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