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Bill: Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote]
Details
Submitted by[?]: Imperial Conservative Union (IA)
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: April 4038
Description[?]:
| OOC: Starting with an open debate. The problem we are running into is titles being confused with one another. Suggestions so far that are unique and don't conflict: 1) Imperial Seal-Bearer/Imperial Seal-Keeper 3) Lord President of the Imperial Diet 5) Prime Minister (not to be confused with the Imperial Prime Minister at the Imperial Level of Government) |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 16:54:49, April 20, 2016 CET | From | Freeborn Luthorians/Freeborn Coalition | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | OOC I suggest 'Imperial Minister of the Diet' |
| Date | 16:54:49, April 20, 2016 CET | From | Freeborn Luthorians/Freeborn Coalition | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | OOC I suggest 'Imperial Minister of the Diet' |
| Date | 17:30:02, April 20, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | My suggestions: Prime Minister (Not to be confused with the Imperial Prime Minister) Lord President of the Imperial Diet First Secretary of State By the way, the reason why ICU brings this up is that technically Finance Minister full title is Chancellor of the Exchequer. We would still have a Chancellor but as in real life UK the Finance Minister would now be refered to as Chancellor. |
| Date | 18:08:09, April 20, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | At the Imperial level at least. At the National level, we still have a Imperial Minister of Finance. "The Privy Council Shall be comprised of, at a minimum, ten Great Officers of the Crown, but shall also include any Imperial Viceroys currently serving within the Empire, and any additional Privy Councillors the Sovereign may wish to appoint. These Great Officers of the Crown shall, where appropriate, head their own government ministries/agencies separate and not under the control of the national cabinet, but funded through the same budgets." 4) Chancellor of the Exchequer, Lord High Treasurer The Chancellor of the Exchequer is one of the most powerful and important officers of the realm. He is jointly in charge of taxation and general government spending but has sole prerogative over the attribution of government spending within the different agencies, ministries and offices of the Imperial government, much like the Imperial Minister of Finance does for the National government. Anyway, if Imperial Seal-Bearer/Keeper is out. Then I lean to Lord President of the Imperial Diet. The others I fear would also get confused with other titles/offices of the empire. |
| Date | 18:30:25, April 20, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | I'm assuming Chancellor is Imperial level and Lord High Treasurer is the Privy title? And one way to look at it is we have an Imperial level and a national level Prime Minister. That's if we went with that option. |
| Date | 21:46:16, April 20, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Yes, that is correct. The first is the Imperial office, and the second is the Privy Council/Crown office. The only ones that are one in the same are the viceroys, national HoG, and the Witch Hunter General (when they exist). |
| Date | 22:53:01, April 20, 2016 CET | From | United Centre | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | I'd prefer 'Prime Minister (not to be confused with the Imperial Prime Minister)' |
| Date | 00:02:35, April 21, 2016 CET | From | Hosian Socialist Party | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Out of tradition I support Imperial Seal-Bearer and I agree with the ICU that the title should be different from any position on the Privy Council. I'd like to suggest turning the Speaker into the Head of Government, I think it would be better if the "Mr. Speaker" that we always address was an actual person with actual power. It would also make sense since the Head of Government represents that national government on the privy council so he would be the Speaker of the Diet/House. |
| Date | 00:46:06, April 21, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Technically Imperial Prime Minister and Prime Minister would be two different titles. And Prime Minister really means the principal minister of an elected government. It's the most natural title to be picked imo. My second choice would be Lord President of the Imperial Diet. Much of the confusion for me doesn't come from the titles but the overlapping of the Privy council and the Imperial office. Then the entirely separate national which is the cabinet. Regarding the Speaker of the Diet. Well the Speaker's job is to preside over the house and enforce order. It's a purely non-partisan position in Westminster systems, so if the HoG was also the speaker that would be a huge conflict of interest. One way to fix this is if someone here volunteered to also occasionally RP in debates as the speaker along with their other MP characters, but they would have to be completely unbiased. |
| Date | 06:58:36, April 22, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Okay, well I think we can narrow it down the remainder above. Out of those, I suggest everyone rank in preference their choices. |
| Date | 07:06:15, April 22, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | My preferences are as follows: 1) Imperial Seal-Bearer/Imperial Seal-Keeper Reason: Traditional, the uniqueness of the title, and it does not conflict with any other title. 2) Lord President of the Imperial Diet Reason: Different, fits the cultural HRE aspect of Luthori, and it does not conflict with any other title. 3) Prime Minister (not to be confused with the Imperial Prime Minister at the Imperial Level of Government) Reason: It conflicts with another title (why we are suggesting the change in the first place). |
| Date | 17:27:07, April 23, 2016 CET | From | National Party of Luthori | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | 1) Prime Minister 2) Lord President of the Imperial Diet 3) Imperial Seal-Bearer |
| Date | 17:28:23, April 23, 2016 CET | From | Hosian Socialist Party | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | 1) Imperial Seal Bearer 2) Lord President of the Imperial Diet (Although I'm not crazy about the usage of president 3) Prime Minister |
| Date | 17:53:58, April 23, 2016 CET | From | United Centre | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Our list is the same as the NPL. |
| Date | 19:29:57, April 23, 2016 CET | From | Conservative Right | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | 1) Imperial Seal-Bearer 2) Prime Minster 3) Lord President of the Imperial Diet |
| Date | 22:51:00, April 23, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Tally so far (weighted scale of 1= 3 points 2= 2 points and 3= 1 point): Imperial Seal-Bearer/Keeper [will decide if chosen which version]: 12 points Lord President of the Imperial Diet: 9 points Prime Minister: 10 points |
| Date | 02:43:31, April 26, 2016 CET | From | Imperial Conservative Union (IA) | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Imperial Seal-Bearer/Keeper appears to have won. Now which version Bearer or Keeper? |
| Date | 08:34:49, April 26, 2016 CET | From | United Centre | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Keeper |
| Date | 11:11:48, April 26, 2016 CET | From | Conservative Right | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | Bearer |
| Date | 00:07:34, April 27, 2016 CET | From | Luthori Democratic Movement Party | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | I like all of them. |
| Date | 10:07:41, June 02, 2016 CET | From | Liberal Party | To | Debating the Head of the National Government Act of 4016 [Old Debate and Vote] |
| Message | OOC: Can someone explain to me why we have two different Prime Minister? Why do we have two tier of national government? Is it not bureau-pathological and inefficient? |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 286 | ||||
| no | Total Seats: 278 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 101 |
| Random fact: Discuss flag designs at the Flag Designs thread: http://forum.particracy.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=37 |
| Random quote: "The man who prefers his country before any other duty shows the same spirit as the man who surrenders every right to the state. They both deny that right is superior to authority." - John Dalberg-Acton |