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Bill: OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum
Details
Submitted by[?]: Nuova Unione
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: November 4290
Description[?]:
| Here is the basic outline: -Chamber of Deputies will be raised to 635 seats --Deputies allowances will be reduced to a nominal salary -Binding referendum will be held on Padagnan autonomy --66.7% of eligible voters must cast a ballot for the result to be binding --50% of voters must support autonomy for it to be instituted I further ask that the text of the bill be changed to read: "A referendum is hereby authorized by the players of Istalia. Such referendum will require a 2/3 majority to pass. The referendum will binding as long as 66.7% of all eligible Padagnan voters turnout. The referendum will require a simply majority of all voting to pass. All parties shall indicate the percentage of support/opposition within their Padagnan party branch (NOT their entire national party) in the comments of this bill. Turnout shall be determined my dividing the total vote count by the population of Padagna: given here http://classic.particracy.net/viewregion.php?regionid=203. Voter turnout shall be calculated by the following formula: Percentage of Party A in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party A PLUS Percentage of Party B in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party B PLUS [...] Percentage of Party Z in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party Z If the referendum is approved, Padagna will be granted a devolved parliament with a First Minister. Other terms will be outlined in the coming days." |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 12:20:04, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | The referendum will need a simple majority at the election, but I think that the approvation of it by the parliament needs 2/3. Like PNP specified during its first proposal to the Parliament for a padagnan referendum. |
| Date | 12:58:48, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | The referendum will indeed only need a simple majority, but constitutional changes always need constitutional majorities (which as far as I am aware is 2/3 of the legislature in favour) |
| Date | 13:04:20, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | So the referendum could be initiated during the upcoming elections, and depending on the result (PNP and FR > 50%) then there should be a proposal to be confirmed by parliament (like in Britain where the people had a non-binding referendum and then parliament triggered article 50) |
| Date | 13:05:41, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Also, as we have 6 parties now getting into parliament, should there be another party supporting federalization (so that we have 3 per camp) |
| Date | 13:06:23, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | FR & PNP in favor, LP against what about the others? |
| Date | 13:32:07, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | I have just some dubts. A Referendum is a RP events and I think that, as per Game Rules, also the approval of a Referendum proposal by the Parliament needs of 2/3 of the players who vote in favor. In fact, I paste here the part of the Game Rules about the referendums: "23.1.1 Role-play events within a nation, such as a financial crash or a civil war, will be officially recognised if before they are commenced, a RP event bill outlining the event is approved by a 2/3rds majority of all players with seats (not just those with seats who vote) and over 50% of the seats in the legislature. This bill must specify the necessary and possible consequences of the role-play event, as well as a clause that deals with the eventuality of one or more players becoming absent for more than a specified time, and how such an absence is to be understood in in-game terms. 23.2 It is permitted to use a RP event bill to institute a referendum. The RP event bill should specify: - the result of the referendum or a full description of how the result will be determined. The bill could arrange for the result to be simulated by applying a simple formula to the outcome of an upcoming election. For example, the RP event bill might list what percentage of voters for each party will vote "Yes" and "No". Alternatively, as an example, the bill might delegate authority for determining the result to a designated player. - the RP event bill should specify the in-game date at which the referendum will be held. For example, it might be held simultaneously with the election, or it might be held a year after the election. - whether the bill is recommendative (ie. the legislature and/or government considers the referendum result and then takes a decison on what to do next) or enactive (ie. the referendum could potentially immediately enact a piece of legislation)." given the fact that it is said "It is permitted to use a RP event bill to institute a referendum", I think that the organization of such event requires the same majority of all other kinds of RP event. About the fronts, i confirm that LP will be against (already I wrote something on the forum) |
| Date | 13:43:58, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | But, wait, the RP event (in OOC) should be approved by the 2/3 of the players. But in IC, i don't know in effect if the parliament should approve it with simple majority or with 2/3. To be sure, I asked to a mod to solve this little dubt. Probably we need of an RP Law to establish if the parliament to approve a referendum (in IC) should be in favor with simple or 2/3 majority. I'll wait for the mods response. |
| Date | 17:05:52, October 15, 2017 CET | From |  Moderation | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: Hi, Since there is no in-game method for holding a referendum, it's necessary to use a role-play event in order to simulate one. In order to do so, you need to pass an OOC bill which outlines what the referendum is, how it will be decided and when it will be held and this needs two-thirds of players to support . Simply passing an in-character bill isn't enough. If you have further questions, please let me know and I'll try to help you out. Thanks, James (Moderation) |
| Date | 18:38:28, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | I support a RP referendum with the format proposed by the LP. |
| Date | 18:44:39, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: i support the RP events of a referendum. But I don't understand. FR: this is the authorization bill for the referendum? |
| Date | 19:03:09, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Nuova Unione | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: Yes, this is the authorization bill. This needs a 2/3. Referendums need 2/3ds IC, right? The one submitted by Aham will need 2/3, just so the opposing forces will be able to say that it was unconstitutional. |
| Date | 19:04:59, October 15, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: ah ok! Perfect. But given the fact that next months will be the elections. I think we have to relaunch it after the elections and then organize new elections to simulate the referendum. It isn't? |
| Date | 00:24:53, October 16, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: will we have the referendum? Or do we assume the federal forces have lost cause of the election result? |
| Date | 09:36:49, October 16, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | I want to have a referendum. Let us see what the people think. |
| Date | 09:44:24, October 16, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | So, I propose to proceed in this way: the next government will stamp out the idea of referendum proposing an authonomous statute for Padagna. The work will last for the legislature but in Padagna the extremists will cause even more trouble with support of several other parties in all Istalia. Probably the PNP at one point will reject the project of an Authonomous Statute and so on pressure also of FR and PdA the Govenrment will accept the referendum. Then, we can call early elections or wait for the next if we are close to it. What do you think? But, for the changement of the Republic... I don't think that there is sufficient support among the istalian players. It isn't? |
| Date | 18:06:50, October 16, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | My President is ardently anti-referendum on this issue. She believes that the integrity of the Istalian nation must be preserved in order to protect its interests. So, expect her to call off the deal with the P.N.P. and perhaps re-enter negotiations with the largest party in the Parliament. As there was a change in government, I think this RP referendum doesn't need to take place, and I will be voting against it both from the OOC perspective and the IG perspective (should it pass the OOC stage). |
| Date | 17:23:58, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | LP results for the Referendum in Padagna: YES: 93% NO: 7% |
| Date | 17:55:11, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | P.d.A results for the referendum in Padagna: Yes: 48% No: 52% |
| Date | 19:42:48, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Nuova Unione | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | NI results for the referendum in Padagna: Yes: 83% No: 17% |
| Date | 20:21:58, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | CC results for the Padagnan Referendum: 76% Opposed to Devolution 24% In Favor of Devolution |
| Date | 22:46:57, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Ooc: I am actually surprised to see Padagnan LP to support the referendum, will make for some exciting inner party struggle! PNP results for Padagnan Autonomy Referendum: YES: 98% NO: 2% |
| Date | 22:52:14, October 17, 2017 CET | From | Uniti Verso il Progresso | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | UVP results for Padagnan Autonomy Referendum: YES: 39% NO: 61% |
| Date | 05:57:07, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: I believe LP means to indicate that they are 93% opposed to Padagnan autonomy, and 7% in favor - not the other way around. Can you clarify, LP? |
| Date | 11:19:30, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | OOC: Yes sorry, it was an error! CC is right. I would write: YES: 7% NO: 93% Sorry! P |
| Date | 12:43:32, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Ok guys, i had some time to calculate a exit poll based on the previous election; YES for Federation: 31.600.567 million votes or 50.64% NO for Federation: 30.750.372 million votes or 49.28% Unknown: 43,572 Thousand votes or 0.08% Let us see how this shifts in the next elections. |
| Date | 20:11:40, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | This closeness is fantastic! Very realistic ! :) |
| Date | 23:18:14, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Per the P.d.A. exit poll based on the previous election: There will not be a referendum on federalization. Instead, there will be a Padagna-only referendum on autonomy. With that in mind, based on the Padagnan election results from 4287: YES to Autonomy: 8,094,722 (65.4%) NO to Autonomy: 4,270,643 (34.5%) UNKNOWN - Spoiled Ballots: 12,552 (0.01%) |
| Date | 23:35:52, October 18, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Please see the latest Corriere d'Istalia article that outlines the deal reached by the P.N.P. and C.C. (on behalf of the government). You can find it here. http://forum.particracy.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=4118&p=122793#p122793 Here is the basic outline: -Chamber of Deputies will be raised to 635 seats --Deputies allowances will be reduced to a nominal salary -Binding referendum will be held on Padagnan autonomy --66.7% of eligible voters must cast a ballot for the result to be binding --50% of voters must support autonomy for it to be instituted NI: I would ask that this bill proposal is renamed: "OOC/RP: Padagna Autonomy Referendum". I further ask that the text of the bill be changed to read: "A referendum is hereby authorized by the players of Istalia. Such referendum will require a 2/3 majority to pass. The referendum will binding as long as 66.7% of all eligible Padagnan voters turnout. The referendum will require a simply majority of all voting to pass. All parties shall indicate the percentage of support/opposition within their Padagnan party branch (NOT their entire national party) in the comments of this bill. Turnout shall be determined my dividing the total vote count by the population of Padagna: given here http://classic.particracy.net/viewregion.php?regionid=203. Voter turnout shall be calculated by the following formula: Percentage of Party A in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party A PLUS Percentage of Party B in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party B PLUS [...] Percentage of Party Z in favor of Referendum TIMES Padagna Vote Percentage of Party Z If the referendum is approved, Padagna will be granted a devolved parliament with a First Minister. Other terms will be outlined in the coming days." |
| Date | 10:52:41, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | P E R F E C T |
| Date | 10:56:29, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | P E R F E C T But, just to recapitulate the results party by party: LP: YES=7% NO= 93% PdA: YES=48% NO= 52% NI: YES=83% NO= 17% CC: YES=24% NO=76% PNP: YES= 98% NO=2% UVP: YES= 39% NO= 61% It is right? |
| Date | 13:43:24, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | This is indeed perfect! |
| Date | 13:53:14, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Oh But: Turnout shall be determined my dividing the total vote count by the population of Padagna: given here There is a problem with that, as the population includes children, as shown by the age distribution graph. So we need to remove that from the total population. I would say that because the age distribution is so bottom heavy, I would say 20% at least are under 18 years old. |
| Date | 14:25:22, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | So if they vote Yes... this means the region should get a new name like ... Regione Autonoma di Padagna. As for PNP... we calculate the total amount of voters who came to the polls. |
| Date | 14:53:28, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Partito degli Agricoltori - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Another question... what autonomy will be granted? Education? Culture? Industry? This can not be voted in regular bills bc this will then be incorperated in the whole country. So this must be RP'ed with empty bills. |
| Date | 21:00:07, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | So do we agree that the number of eligible voters (due sustain the 66.7% clause) is lower than the total population of Padagna? I would say as there is almost 20 million people, and 20 % would not be eligible due to the bottom heavy age distribution, I would say there are 16 million people eligible to vote. This would also suit the narrative as last elections 12 million have cast their vote. Do we agree on the 16 million eligible voters number for the 66.7% clause? |
| Date | 21:49:33, October 19, 2017 CET | From | Alleanza Radicale - NCD | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Yes I agree. NI, please, can you copy the text of CC and the number of elegible voters into the description and launch the vote as we all agree? Thank you |
| Date | 01:17:38, October 20, 2017 CET | From | Lega Giusnaturalistica | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | How about just using the national turnout figure? If not, I'm fine with the (somewhat arbitrary) 16 million figure. |
| Date | 15:10:54, October 20, 2017 CET | From | Partito Nazionale Democratico | To | Debating the OOC/RP: Padagnan autonomy referendum |
| Message | Oh the national turnout figure? Right there is one which shows the % nationwide, forgot about it it completely. Ye we can use that. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 355 | |||||||
| no | Total Seats: 0 | |||||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: Periodically, it is a good idea to go through your nation's Treaties and arrange to withdraw from any that are unwanted. |
| Random quote: "The greatness of a nation can be judged by the way its animals are treated" - Mahatma Gandhi |