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Bill: Anti-WMD bill
Details
Submitted by[?]: Soziale Gegenseitigkeitspartei
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This is an ordinary bill. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: June 4332
Description[?]:
| Classifies chemical and biological weapons on the same level as nuclear weapons, and restricts their use to times of national peril. |
Proposals
Article 1
Proposal[?] to change The government's policy concerning the use of chemical and biological weaponry in warfare.
Old value:: The nation reserves the right to use chemical or biological weapons in warfare for any reason.
Current: The nation reserves the right to use chemical or biological weapons in warfare for any reason.
Proposed: The nation shall never use chemical or biological weapons in warfare unless another nation uses them first.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 02:08:26, January 11, 2018 CET | From | Soziale Gegenseitigkeitspartei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Council. I present to you now a bill designed to save innocent lives, and end a brutal form of warfare considered by many nations to be a war crime. Chemical and Biological weapons maim and kill indiscriminately and cruelly. This will merge our nuclear weapons policy with our chemical weapons one, limiting bureaucracy while setting a clear policy on all types of WMD's. This may not be far enough for some,and there is indeed some contention within my own party for measures banning the use of these weapons altogether. But it is a start, and I urge all councillors to support this bill, to prevent innocent deaths in warfare. |
| Date | 16:52:39, January 11, 2018 CET | From | Partei für Fortschritt und Gerechtigkei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | We completely agree. Hear, hear! Leopoldina Schneider PFG Leader (OOC: you can probably just go straight to a vote on these bills by the way haha!) |
| Date | 19:02:39, January 11, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | The purpose of this policy is to ensure that Dorvik is rightly respected across the world for its military capabilities. This weapons discourage foreign powers from aggression against Dorvik. This bill will not save any lives, because these weapons will never be used. By having them, we prevent innocent death by preventing other nations from warring with us. You are simply making us a target. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
| Date | 20:03:36, January 11, 2018 CET | From | Soziale Gegenseitigkeitspartei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Mr Frantz Perhaps you have missed the fact that these weapons would still exist as a deterrent? This bill merely restricts the use of these weapons to times where we are facing an enemy who is also using these deplorable weapons of slaughter. |
| Date | 20:48:34, January 11, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | It indeed remains more of a deterrent with this policy. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
| Date | 00:02:31, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Partei für Fortschritt und Gerechtigkei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | *Schneider laughs at Frantz.* |
| Date | 00:50:37, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Hosian-Konservative Allianz | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Herr Frantz, Unfortunately, our enemies are not honorable. They do not care for ideology, politics, left, right, liberal, conservative. They care about victory. Dorvik care's about victory, that is why every soldier fights for Sacred Dorvik, that is why every soldier in Dorvik fights towards the Final Victory. The Social Nationalist Party have recently re-appeared on the scene of Dorvish politics, at time when loyalty, perseverance and order is needed, not only in Dorvik but throughout the world. Johannes Augustus von Rohr-Mauss, Chairman of the Social Nationalist Party |
| Date | 00:58:02, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Herr Rohr-Mauss Exactly, that is why we do not seek to cut off our noses to spike our faces. The battlefield is not the place for moral absolutism. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
| Date | 01:04:03, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Hosian-Konservative Allianz | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | OOC: Oops, I didn't mean to address Herr Frantz, that is my mistake. I thought that was SGP's representative. My apologies! |
| Date | 03:08:51, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Soziale Gegenseitigkeitspartei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Herr Rohr-Mauss, I did not claim that our 'enemies' cared about our politics. Merely that using weapons designed to slaughter innocent lives is wrong. As we'd retain the ability to retaliate if this type of attack is used on our citizens, this would not diminish our effectiveness on the battlefield. The quote on quote "Final Victory" of which you speak should involve an absolute minimum of lives lost. Augusta Lachner SGP Chairperson for Matters of Defence |
| Date | 17:10:03, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Frau Lachner Nobody is suggesting they care about our politics. What you are failing to understand is your morality is not objective and not shared. Our enemies do not care about our morality, not our politics. These weapons are highly controlled and regulated by the military, they are not used on civilian targets and have yet to be used in general. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
| Date | 19:47:07, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Partei für Fortschritt und Gerechtigkei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | It seems everybody here has dissolved into debating using nothing but vague politicised remarks. Let me return to the issue at hand in practical terms. Frankly, this stops nobody: if these weapons will never be used, then what is the point in this? Surely, we should be warning our enemies that using these weapons will result absolutely in a direct response in the same fashion. We should avoid this, as it is indiscriminate mass murder of innocent civilian, but mutually assured destruction is certainly better than the militarist nonsense we have now. This isn't about what the enemy thinks of our morality. This is about limiting the amount of indiscriminate murder we commit. You say they are not used on civilian targets, but biological and chemical weapons are volatile and frequently impact others than the target -- even our own troops. It doesn't sacrifice safety: mutually assured destruction is still in place. But it will gain us international support. Sure, the enemy cares little for our morality. But our allies do. Imagine, too, if a chemical weapons was to impact nearby country? We would lose support immediately. Please present a reasonable argument as to why we should not change this policy? You rant on about abortion, but openly support mass murder involving innocent people? I mean, this doesn't impact us militarily at all. So the question, Herr Frantz, is whether you wish to support the murder of innocent people to maintain some air of military superiority, or to accept that morality does in fact have a place in war and that this is a dangerous and immoral weapon to use, unnecessary and sickening to support? Leopoldina Schneider PFG Leader |
| Date | 20:50:19, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Frau Schneider They serve as a deterrent. That is their purpose. By having them, we assure they will never be used because nobody will go to war with us. You clearly fail to understand the precautions taken with this weaponry. This isn't the classical era, chemical weaponry is heavily contained and precision. They are not to be used anywhere near civilian sites, and are not used against civilian sties.To lack trust in our military so deeply is frightening. You have brought up a total red herring. This weaponry does not and will not murder innocent people. The only way it could kill civilians is if it was used near or on a civilian target, which it would not be. We do not support 'mass murder involving innocent people'. This weaponry is mostly non-lethal, and serves to incapacitate not to kill. Furthermore, enemy combatants are not innocent and as I have stated before and continue to stress, civilian casualties are practically impossible. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
| Date | 22:56:50, January 12, 2018 CET | From | Soziale Gegenseitigkeitspartei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Herr Frantz, I would like to raise another angle on this debate. By allowing chemical weapons to be used in standard warfare, we create a precedent that allows our enemy to respond in kind, which threatens our own troops and civilians. On the other hand, if we prevent warfare from escalating to that point, our own side is safer. Chemical weapons are potentially as dangerous as nuclear weapons, please allow us to treat them with the same amount of respect. Furthermore, the SGP is strongly of the opinion that chemical weapons are an inhumane method of warfare, and should not ever be used unless the enemy raises the same level of threat. Augusta Lachner SGP Chairperson for Matters of Defence |
| Date | 00:10:20, January 13, 2018 CET | From | Grüne Demokratische Partei | To | Debating the Anti-WMD bill |
| Message | Frau Lachner, This debate has regressed enough. We have made our bed, and the chamber has chosen to sleep in it. Alfred Frantz Minister of Science and Technology |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||
| yes | Total Seats: 174 | ||||
| no |
Total Seats: 291 | ||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 93 |
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