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Bill: Constitutional Debate - For Archiving
Details
Submitted by[?]: United Liberal Alliance
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: September 2320
Description[?]:
| We would like to create an open debate on all matters of the constitution of Telamon. Specifically relating to changing the name of the House of Commons and (if people can think of better titles) those of the President and Prime Minister. We would also like to debate the relative powers of the Head of State and the number of seats in the legislature |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 21:13:42, October 04, 2006 CET | From | United Liberal Alliance | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | For our opening submission to this debate we would make some of the following suggestions: 1: The House of Commons: Obviously for almost all of Telamonian history up until I left it was called Parliament. My problem with the title House of Commons is two fold: Firstly it suggests that there should be another chamber which there is not (but in fairness this is a problem with many names that we could have for the legislature) and its implication of inferiority (whilst through historical reasons it is fine and applicable in Britain, in Telamon from the history that we wrote there was no House of Lords or equivalent and so the title is not really applicable here). Instead we would like to propose some of the following as alternative names (some of which are better than others!): Parliament Congress House of Representatives House of Assembly House of Councillors National Assembly State Assembly Chamber of Deputies Legislative Assembly Legislative Council National Legislative Assembly National Legislative Council Congress of Deputies Parliamentary Assembly State Council General Assembly House of Delegates National Council Commonwealth Parliament Commonwealth Assembly Commonwealth Council Commonwealth Congress Assembly of Representatives 2. We are happy with the titles President and Prime Minister but if other people have suggestions then please do suggest 3. Presidential Powers: We would like to suggest that we work according to a semi-Presidential system. I.e. the President is essentially a figurehead and the Head of State. The President should have the sole power to appoint a government but all parties must agree(by legislative convention) that if they gain the Presidency they will appoint a government which has the support of the majority of the legislature. If the President is from the same coalition as the government then they may get involved in domestic politics If not, then they should become essentially a figurehead and consign themselves to commenting on and dealing with foreign and defence policy 4. We reopen the debate on the number of seats in the legislature |
| Date | 21:15:48, October 04, 2006 CET | From | Telamon Royalist Party | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | We are in favour of Parliament, or even better, Parliament of the Commonwealth, for the reasons stated above. We of course would like to see a Queen with no power rather than an elected head of state, but that can be dealt with at a later time. |
| Date | 21:18:15, October 04, 2006 CET | From | United Liberal Alliance | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | 5. Regions: Whilst we're ok with the title Cantons I don't really like the title so here are some alternatives: Department District Province County Region Borough Parish |
| Date | 21:21:55, October 04, 2006 CET | From | United Liberal Alliance | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | 6. National Anthem: Obviously I don't think that the currenty official anthem is appropriate therefore I either suggest we return to what is now the nominal anthem: Come, fellow Telamonians Let us progress towards happiness together May our noble aspiration bring Telamon success Come, let us unite In a new spirit Let our voices soar as one Onward Telamon Onward Telamon OR: Land of Hope and Glory, Mother of the Free, How shall we extoll thee Who are born of thee. Wider still and wider Shall thy bounds be set, God who made thee mighty Make thee mightier yet; God who made thee mighty Make thee mightier yet Or if people have any better suggestions.... |
| Date | 21:43:33, October 04, 2006 CET | From | Telamon Labour Party | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | 1. Parliament should be good. 5. I suggest County or District |
| Date | 03:06:35, October 05, 2006 CET | From | Catholic Workers Union | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | 1. I certainly support the idea of renaming it the "Commonwealth Congress". This is a unique name, original to Telamon, and has a nice ring to it. I throw my support 100% behind this. 2. The names of the leaders are relatively unimportant. I prefer President and Prime Minister, but other suggestions could be interesting. 3. We support returning cabinet choices to the presidency, but suggest that no requirement be made that the president take a purely passive role in government affairs. After all, the presidency should be something different parties fight over, not something that is meaningless and which will be used to appoint a cabinet of the majority. Make the game more interesting, make the HoS powerful. 4. The seat number should be returned to 301, or better yet 300. I've listed why numerous times, but here it is again. At 301, a majority is 151 seats, and the majority for a constitutional change is 201. It's really that easy. All other numbers are nasty. Also, at 300, and with this number of parties, we make getting more than 100 seats extremely rewarding, and a sign of an important party. We implore the House to return us to this sanity. 5. As for Region names, we prefer Canton, and would really rather not change it. Preserve our Canton Commonwealth. 6. Both your national anthems are infinitely preferrable to our present one. Let's try and get this done before elections, so that we only need the support of the UCA, IADP and TRP to pass. That makes everything easier, and the changes will be put in place before the election, which is better for everyone. |
| Date | 10:40:12, October 05, 2006 CET | From | United Liberal Alliance | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | We we can try!! Lets finish negotiations rather quickly then!!! 1. Whilst I probably prefer Commonwealth Parliament (as OOC I'm British!!) I can live with Commonwealth Congress if others can 2. We can keep President and Prime Minister 3. As regards the HoS, we weren't actually suggesting (though I think it did sound as though we were) that the HoS should have no power - we want to make them more powerful. But we are not a Presidential system (that is clear from the fact that the President does not chair the cabinet and so is not directly involved in government. Most of the time as the President and government are of the same coalition, this is not a problem. We were simply suggesting that we have an institutional framework for the occassions when cohabitation occurs (i.e. the President and Parliamentary majority are different). We were simply trying to get all parties to commit themselves that in this event they would appoint a government with a legislative majority (it is a necessary safeguard if we are going to give the HoS the sole power to appoint governments as there is a small potential for this to be abused and for the HoS to keep unrepresentative and unpopular governments in power). We are only suggesting a return to what used to happen in Telamon and to sort of what happens in France which is the closest RL political system to ours in terms of the relationship between legislature, government and President. We do believe that the legislature must be the ultimate source of power (though that is a more British idea!!) 5. I don't know exactly why but I really don't like Canton, which is why I proposed to change it! I'll propose a draft consitutional bill containing reforms for you to comment on - if you still just have general ideas then continue to post them here |
| Date | 11:32:54, October 05, 2006 CET | From | United Liberal Alliance | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | We would also like to debate changing the national motto, though this isn't that important it is just that I liked the old one: Always To Be The Best or Ever To Be The Best We could have it in the original ancient Greek if people preferred? |
| Date | 21:54:03, October 05, 2006 CET | From | Catholic Workers Union | To | Debating the Constitutional Debate - For Archiving |
| Message | I don't like that motto, but I don't like our present one either. Let's think harder. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||||||
| yes |
Total Seats: 247 | ||||||
| no | Total Seats: 0 | ||||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 54 |
| Random fact: Selucia is Particracy's modern take on Ancient Rome, located on the continent of Majatra. |
| Random quote: "In politics, you have your word and your friends; go back on either and you're dead." - Morton C. Blackwell |