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Bill: Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo
Details
Status[?]: passed
Votes: This bill is a resolution. It requires more yes votes than no votes. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: May 2965
Description[?]:
| It is a sad day for a democracy when a minority government starts a war without the backing of the legislature. Sadly, this appears to be what our government is currently doing, and so we propose this motion to condemn this evil action. Innocent Sekowans will die as a result of this war, as well as many Trigunian soldiers who simply should not be there. All this in the name of the Hulstro-Luthori alliance, which merely uses Trigunia as a puppet and treats Trigunians as second class citizens. The MGP will reap the rewards of this action in the next election when Trigunians will turn against them in their millions. OOC: We know we could technically kick up a fuss and stop Trigunia's involvement in this war, but particracy is in need of some good RP nowadays, and realistically the government could perform these executive actions (just like western governments have for the past 60 years) |
Proposals
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 18:50:09, July 06, 2010 CET | From |  Old Guard Party (CГП) | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | OOC: Yea, that is part of the reason I didn't ask you guys, I figured a "police action" (think LBJ and Vietnam) would add some flavor to things. |
| Date | 20:54:33, July 06, 2010 CET | From |  Natsionalʹnaya Patrioticheskaya Partiya | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | Our party openly condemns the war and the Molodaya Gvardiya Partiya altogether. The Molodaya Gvardiya Partiya have made fools of themselves since they fell from power. Not only have they tried to hold onto power, but they have also blocked key reforms. Not proposing a new, more popular, majority government simply because you are not willing to accept defeat despite clearly losing is quite embarrassing. Such war should have been proposed and debated in the legislative assembly. I seem to remember someone from the Molodaya Gvardiya Partiya saying that debate is important, yet on this matter it got no debate and no vote! Molodaya Gvardiya Partiya is frail, and they're making Trigunia a laughing stock. Trigunia should be one of the most powerful and prosperous nations on Terra, but we are simply other nations' lap-dog as the Molodaya Gvardiya Partiya allows them to 'rape' our people, resources, and our own forces as they desire. Our party, following the next elections, will condemn this war, will sever ties with the so called 'alliance', will offer its condolences to the Trigunian and Sekowan families who have lost loved ones, will offer money to aid Sekowo and will also seek to set up relations between our two nations. |
| Date | 21:21:31, July 06, 2010 CET | From | Old Guard Party (CГП) | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | The MGP seems to remember the Communists claiming that debate was not important, only the PERCEPTION of debate was important to them. Trigunia has made great strides in the economy, in education, and in social reforms since the MGP came to power nearly eight decades ago. Trigunians have, since the fall of the previous Communist dictatorship, been allowed to own and operate their own business and directly influence their income. Likewise, the MGP has maintained a minimal income tax and has kept government spending low, which has seen great strides in growth GDP. The Great Prince is in personal union to Trigunia and therefore is not affiliated with Hulstria or other nations. Likewise, the MGP has retained Trigunian sovereignty by exiting several treaties tying Trigunia to the Axis organization. At the same time, the MGP has begun negotiating, before the arrival of the Communists and Deltarians, in the creation of a pan-Kerisian sporting organization which would be a segway towards a larger Kerisian economic and cultural union and exchange. We do not see this as being a "lapdog". If the Communists would be so kind as to explain just where Trigunia has been dominated by foreign elements, it would greatly appreciated. However, the MGP finds the Communists' xenophobia disturbing and remains frightened that the Communists will usher in an age of seclusion and isolation in which they will foster a "cult of personality" or a "cult of party", replacing religion with party. The record the MGP shows that it has respected the rights of Trigunians, it has respected the economic ingenuity of the people of Trigunia and it has respected the efforts of the international community to eliminate threats to peace in this hemisphere. |
| Date | 21:37:04, July 06, 2010 CET | From | Natsionalʹnaya Patrioticheskaya Partiya | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | Firstly, we did not say that. Your party put forward the case that allowing parties to propose more bills would recuce debate, but it wouldn't and that was proved. But a vote would have prevented Trigunian participation in this war, as would a strong majority government, not a weak one that not many people voted for. We did not listen to your history lesson on the monarchy, although it was appreciated greatly. We would like to reassure you that Trigunia under our party would be much more prosperous. It would not be isolated either, but we would not meddle in other nations' business or start a war. Your claims regarding our party are completely incorrect. Our party would simply bring democracy to Trigunia, replacing the monarchy with an elected HOS that represents the people of Trigunia. And also, as we have stated, we are not against religion. The record of the MGP quite clearly shows that it is power hungry and does not support greater democracy. |
| Date | 00:01:15, July 07, 2010 CET | From | Natsionalʹnaya Patrioticheskaya Partiya | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | On behalf of Taisei Gekokujō (大成下克上) "We honor the democratic sprit shown by those who oppose the monstrous war of aggression being fought against our people, and hope Trigunskoye will succeed in removing the pro-war stooges who have sent your soldiers to a quarrel which does not concern them." |
| Date | 02:14:07, July 07, 2010 CET | From | Old Guard Party (CГП) | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | The Communists say they want to have debate, then do not have it. It has truly perplexed the Young Guards and their supporters. Debate means let it be discussed, not send it to vote. Because there is no debate, all that will happen is that a party will win a majority and propose whatever it likes (now MUCH easier to do having 50 proposals to throw out) and then pass them; then, along will come another party that will do the same. Instead, let us discuss the proposals and come to a compromise on the issues that divide the nation. No one may be truly happy, but they will at least be somewhat happy. It is this Communist lack of discussion and debate that will breed only rejection and revenge by parties in the future; which does not help regular Trigunians. In what way will the economy be better and more prosperous? Since when has government ownership of everything ever done that? Do you mean to tell the nation that yours will be the first? We ask that the Communists, althought they certainly do not trust history, to read the speech given by Viceroy Mashkov in early 2948 for more information regarding the economic growth in Trigunia: http://forum.particracy.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=90&start=20#p20120 The Young Guards understand that you claim to not be against religion ... but we feel that you are as long as it is your Party that is worshiped. Interesting. The Young Guards have to ask, do the Communists not know what an elected executive is?! Because it is an elected exective that Trigunia currently has! The Viceroyalty is an elected official; parties are able to run their candidate and potentially win, the Deltarian-Nationalists have held the Viceroyalty before. Likewise, the official title of the position is "Viceroy of HRNH Great Prince Ferdinand I, Steward of the State, and Deputy of the People" and it is within those areas that the Viceroy operates. The Viceroy was meant to be an elected position and is to remain as such. There is little reason to believe that the Viceroyalty cannot exist with a Communist incumbent, afterall, "Deputy of the People" should sound familiar to all Communists. |
| Date | 11:09:43, July 07, 2010 CET | From | Natsionalʹnaya Patrioticheskaya Partiya | To | Debating the Condemnation of the Imperialist war in Sekowo |
| Message | We like the way the MGP has started to move away from the original matter, and how "all that will happen is that a party will win a majority and propose whatever it likes" describes your party so well. Admit it, your party is frail, desperate and power hungry. We will not read or believe anything from a 'Viceroy', the monarchy is a rich man's dictatorship. You have the wrong view of my party, you're making up things to say against us. How have you got the idea that our party wants to be 'worshipped'? Its your party that wants to still be 'worshipped' and wants to 'worship' a King or Queen! Its simply a representative of an unelected rich person. "Deputy of the People" means nothing in a monarchy, its simply to try to get support from the people. Admit it it, the monarchy represents no one but itself, who else in Trigunia lives in a Palace and has money like the monarchy does. Stop worshipping them or the people wont worship you. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | ||
| yes |
Total Seats: 395 | ||
| no |
Total Seats: 205 | ||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: By default the head of government is the ultimate authority within a national government. In general terms, heads of government are expected to consult with cabinet colleagues (including those from other parties) before making significant decisions but they remain responsible for government action. |
| Random quote: "The trouble with practical jokes is that very often they get elected." - Will Rogers |