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Bill: ICP's New Positions Bill
Details
Submitted by[?]: Independent Capitalist Party
Status[?]: defeated
Votes: This bill proposes the withdrawal from a treaty. It will require half of the legislature to vote in favor[?]. This bill will not pass any sooner than the deadline.
Voting deadline: July 2170
Description[?]:
| This bill will do much needed reforms to Aloria. |
Proposals
Article 1
Withdraw from the CIS Community Treaty.
Article 2
Withdraw from the Treaty for the Protection of Endangered Animals.
Article 3
Withdraw from the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
Article 4
Proposal[?] to change Government policy towards alcoholic beverages.
Old value:: Alcoholic beverages may be purchased and consumed anywhere, but only by adults.
Current: Alcoholic beverages may be purchased only from licensed sales outlets, and can only be available to adults.
Proposed: Alcoholic beverage regulations are not imposed by the government.
Article 5
Proposal[?] to change Listing of controversial ingredients, such as genetically modified (GM) ingredients (if food labelling is applied).
Old value:: Any chemicals used in agrigulture or processing, and any GM ingredients must be listed.
Current: Any chemicals used in agrigulture or processing, and any GM ingredients must be listed.
Proposed: There is no requirement to disclose GM ingredients, or chemicals used in agrigulture or processing.
Article 6
Proposal[?] to change Licensing of food sales.
Old value:: Food may be sold by licensed vendors only, and shelf lives of foods are enforced.
Current: Food may be sold by licensed vendors only, and shelf lives of foods are enforced.
Proposed: The sale of food is unregulated.
Article 7
Proposal[?] to change Health care policy.
Old value:: There is a free public health care system and a small number of private clinics, which are heavily regulated to ensure they treat their patients well and provide good care.
Current: There is a public health care system, but private clinics are allowed.
Proposed: Health care is entirely private.
Article 8
Proposal[?] to change The regulation of higher education.
Old value:: The government allows private higher education but regulates it to meet nationally set standards.
Current: The government allows private higher education but regulates it to meet nationally set standards.
Proposed: The government does not fund any public higher education institutions, permitting only private higher education institutions to exist.
Article 9
Proposal[?] to change Higher education tuition policy.
Old value:: The government subsidizes tuition only for students from families classified as low-income or poor.
Current: The government subsidizes higher education tuition to a certain amount, the rest is covered by the individual students. This includes scholarship programs.
Proposed: The government does not subsidize tuition, students must pay for higher education themselves. This does not include scholarship programs.
Article 10
Proposal[?] to change Health and safety legislation for industry.
Old value:: The government introduces and actively regulates health and safety legislation in all areas of industry.
Current: The government introduces and actively regulates health and safety legislation in all areas of industry.
Proposed: Health and safety laws are to be determined by local governments.
Article 11
Proposal[?] to change The nation's policy on minimum wage regulation.
Old value:: There shall be a minimum wage at a level that a single full time worker on it can adequately subsist.
Current: There shall be a minimum wage at a level considered a "living wage," well above the poverty line for a full time worker.
Proposed: There is no provision for a minimum wage.
Article 12
Proposal[?] to change Government regulation of pollution in industry.
Old value:: The government enforces highly restrictive industrial pollution standards.
Current: The government provides pollution prevention guidelines, but does not enforce them.
Proposed: Industrial pollution is not regulated by the government.
Article 13
Proposal[?] to change The government's policy concerning the post office
Old value:: There is a nationalised post office. Private post office agencies are allowed to exist, and the services provided by them are not regulated.
Current: There is a nationalised post office. Private post office agencies are allowed to exist, and the services provided by them are not regulated.
Proposed: Only private post agencies exist, and the services they provide are unregulated.
Article 14
Proposal[?] to change The education system.
Old value:: There is a free public education system alongside private schools.
Current: There is a free public education system and a small number of private schools, which are heavily regulated to ensure they teach adequate skills and information.
Proposed: Education is entirely private and schools run on a for-profit basis.
Article 15
Proposal[?] to change Government-sponsored recycling programs.
Old value:: The government funds recycling facilities and enforces mandatory recycling for residents, commercial enterprise, and industry.
Current: Local governments decide about this.
Proposed: There is no national policy regarding recycled garbage.
Article 16
Proposal[?] to change Government policy on sexual relations.
Old value:: Sexual relations of all types are legal for consenting adults.
Current: Sexual relations of all types are legal for consenting adults.
Proposed: Sexual relation laws are set by local governments.
Debate
These messages have been posted to debate on this bill:
| Date | 20:46:11, January 11, 2006 CET | From |  Democratic Liberal Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | We disagree with every single proposal in this bill. The treaties mentioned are in fact great means of improving the world, we are surprised at the proposed withdrawal. Withdrawal from the sed treaties would isolate Aloria in the international community. We are extremely concerned by the ICP's advocacy of privatisation of the health services, education services and postal services. The government has a responsibility to provide these much needed aspects of Alorians' lives and profit making has no place in it. The devolution of neccesary regulations concerns us greatly and is opposed on the grounds that it may lead to poor standards and puts Alorians' lives in danger. The same goes for sexual relation laws as a basic human right. We are shocked at the ICP's ignoring of environment regulations - we cannot allow this to happen as the air will being still more polluted. This is indeed a worrying move. We oppose the end of regulation to alcohol laws on the grounds that it will lead to young people binge drinking. We are unhappy at the proposed end of proper food labelling as Alorians have a right to know what they're eating. In conclusion we oppose this hash of a bill that damages civil liberties, basic standards, foreign relations and economic fairness in Aloria. |
| Date | 20:51:57, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | "We disagree with every single proposal in this bill." I expected that. This bill will show to the capitalist deregulatory majority of the Alorian population what the socialist majority is really like. "The treaties mentioned are in fact great means of improving the world, we are surprised at the proposed withdrawal. Withdrawal from the sed treaties would isolate Aloria in the international community." They prevent our national sovereignty. And at least the ICP can spell "said." The treaties were written by environmentalist socialists. The people of Aloria are capialist devolutionist non-environmentalists. "We are extremely concerned by the ICP's advocacy of privatisation of the health services, education services and postal services. The government has a responsibility to provide these much needed aspects of Alorians' lives and profit making has no place in it." The national government in a confederacy should have as little power as possible. "The devolution of neccesary regulations concerns us greatly and is opposed on the grounds that it may lead to poor standards and puts Alorians' lives in danger. The same goes for sexual relation laws as a basic human right." This is the Confederated Regions of Aloria. If you wanted a strong national government you should have joined another country. The government restrictions are wrong. "We are shocked at the ICP's ignoring of environment regulations - we cannot allow this to happen as the air will being still more polluted. This is indeed a worrying move." Global warming is BS. There is not a single proof. Glaciers that are supposedly melting are growing in other areas, glaciers that are disappearing are balanced out by glaciers that are reappearing. There is a natural cycle of ice ages and that balances out any "damage" we could do. Restrictions do nothing but hurt our economy. "We oppose the end of regulation to alcohol laws on the grounds that it will lead to young people binge drinking." The socialists are for 15 year olds as adults. What young people? "We are unhappy at the proposed end of proper food labelling as Alorians have a right to know what they're eating." If a company does not label food, people won't buy from them. Thus the market regulates itself. Government regulations are simply a waste of taxpayer's money. "In conclusion we oppose this hash of a bill that damages civil liberties, basic standards, foreign relations and economic fairness in Aloria." In conclusion, I cut down all of your arguments so that you have no right to call it those names. |
| Date | 20:53:47, January 11, 2006 CET | From |  Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | ooc: you play the game, rather than being in the game... there are no game engines in Aloria.. you seem to get IC and OOC confused ICP... |
| Date | 20:56:55, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | OOC: ICly, I play as the party that was formerly centrist but turned capitalist to give the capitalist majority a better voice in a country that has 8/10 socialist parties. |
| Date | 21:07:53, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Democratic Liberal Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | "I expected that. This bill will show to the capitalist deregulatory majority of the Alorian population what the socialist majority is really like." We are not, in actual fact, socialist. "They prevent our national sovereignty. And at least the ICP can spell "said." The treaties were written by environmentalist socialists. The people of Aloria are capialist devolutionist non-environmentalists." I worry that if we do withdraw from these treaties certain groups (such as the ICP) will turn our laws extremely anti-environmentalist and destroy the natural values of Aloria. Does the ICP not believe in international co-operation, furthermore? Does he want Aloria isolated from the rest of the planey? "The national government in a confederacy should have as little power as possible." The fact remains, Private companies whose primay objective is profit-making cannot be trusted to provide our healthcare, education and postal services. The government is elected and seeks to serve the people. "This is the Confederated Regions of Aloria. If you wanted a strong national government you should have joined another country. The government restrictions are wrong." Nevertheless it is risky to let local governments decide the law on matters of basuc human rights. "Global warming is BS. There is not a single proof. Glaciers that are supposedly melting are growing in other areas, glaciers that are disappearing are balanced out by glaciers that are reappearing. There is a natural cycle of ice ages and that balances out any "damage" we could do. Restrictions do nothing but hurt our economy." This is exactly the "not a problem" view that could one day destroy the world. There is evidence of global warming and we cannot ignore the fact. "The socialists are for 15 year olds as adults. What young people?" We remind the ICP, the DLP is not socialist and does not favour 15 year olds as adults. Therefore that is not an argument. Even if we did advocate 15 year old adults, what about the children under 15 who would be allowed to drink uncontrolled? "If a company does not label food, people won't buy from them. Thus the market regulates itself. Government regulations are simply a waste of taxpayer's money." We do not agree. This could lead to so many problems and people will not necesarily not buy from companies who do not adequately label food. The government should ensure that Alorians' safety comes first. "In conclusion, I cut down all of your arguments so that you have no right to call it those names." In conclusion, I have cut down all your counter-arguments and the ICP should withdraw this travesty immeidately! |
| Date | 22:25:41, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | ooc: I'll believe you for now.. *makes shifty eyes* |
| Date | 22:30:27, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Democratic Liberal Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | We also wish to express our disapointment that the ICP did not give this bill sufficient debate time before sending it to the vote. We feel a full debate on this bill which contains so many different aspects and themes is more appropriate. |
| Date | 22:41:21, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Freedom Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | The Freedom Party objects to the treaty withdrawals. We also find some of the positions taken by the Independent "Centrist" Party to be quite disturbing. |
| Date | 22:48:30, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | OOC: Power went out with a point by point. IC: 1) Debate has been dead lately. I don't see anyone else debating. 2) Independent Centrist Party? Where? |
| Date | 22:54:20, January 11, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | "We are not, in actual fact, socialist." Yes, still regulator. Does that make you a social democrat or a communist? "I worry that if we do withdraw from these treaties certain groups (such as the ICP) will turn our laws extremely anti-environmentalist and destroy the natural values of Aloria. Does the ICP not believe in international co-operation, furthermore? Does he want Aloria isolated from the rest of the planey?" Well, we can have international relations without restrictions imposed by treaties on our legislature. If someone had the half to pass a bad bill, they'd have enough to withdraw from the treaty and all it would do is slow them down. Meanwhile, some clauses of the treaty restrict our freedom to democratically decide for ourselves what to do. "The fact remains, Private companies whose primay objective is profit-making cannot be trusted to provide our healthcare, education and postal services. The government is elected and seeks to serve the people." The government monopoly is *worse* than private companies. The companies will work well to outpreform the compitition. The government monopoly will do inadequate services that everyone is charged for via taxes. Should a single man with no children pay for public education? "Nevertheless it is risky to let local governments decide the law on matters of basuc human rights." This is still a confederacy. The local government should be able to decide everything possible. This is because the more local the government, the more accurately it represents the needs of the people. "This is exactly the "not a problem" view that could one day destroy the world. There is evidence of global warming and we cannot ignore the fact." Well, if you brought up evidence and convinced me why regulating our industry, hurting our economy, and bringing us back to the 1700s was good, then perhaps I'd support anti-global warming laws. If not, it's your fault for not convincing. "We remind the ICP, the DLP is not socialist and does not favour 15 year olds as adults. Therefore that is not an argument. Even if we did advocate 15 year old adults, what about the children under 15 who would be allowed to drink uncontrolled?" Some uncontrollable parents will let their children do it anyways. Why waste taxpayer money? If they do unwise things, nature will have the concequences on them. Why waste taxpayer money? "We do not agree. This could lead to so many problems and people will not necesarily not buy from companies who do not adequately label food. The government should ensure that Alorians' safety comes first." Communist answer that the government should do everything. "In conclusion, I have cut down all your counter-arguments and the ICP should withdraw this travesty immeidately!" In conclusion, I countered your counter-counter-arguments TWICE (and the first time the computer crashed)! |
| Date | 00:14:03, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Wow. Everyone's against it but me, eh? |
| Date | 00:15:41, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Alright, I'll do the reproposal in smaller bits thing I did after the failure of the Mega Bill I had a while ago. Tell me which parts you disagree with and I'll break them into parts so that at least something of it can pass. |
| Date | 01:33:19, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | All of them! |
| Date | 01:43:29, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Well, duh, you're a socialist and the dead opposite of me. I was thinking more on swing voters (SRP, LGDP, FP, FCP) who vote with me some of the time. |
| Date | 01:45:01, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | I read through them all.. Their too exteme to attract much support. Are you the opposite of compassionate and caring? |
| Date | 01:49:49, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | No. I'm just the opposite of Green and Socialist. Which makes my party, at the stage it is in right now, the exact opposite of yours. :P |
| Date | 01:50:07, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | (Well, besides being life-life-life.) |
| Date | 12:45:34, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | The Environment-hating Capititalist Party? Has a nice ring... |
| Date | 13:11:58, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | No. Just against government restrictions. If people want to help the environment they should do it without the government. |
| Date | 16:10:50, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | But people don't, if they are left up to their own devices- that's how economics work. people wouldn't pay to have street lighting or lighthouses or parks either, so they have to be provided. The environment is also one these things: a common good. The goal of democracy is to provide these things. |
| Date | 18:50:55, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | People pay for it. Via taxes. It makes Aloria the worst economy in Terra. |
| Date | 21:10:23, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Ergo, the government pays for the environment. |
| Date | 21:15:42, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Through the taxpayers money. If the environmental protections are on the big MAYBE and IF of environmental damage, then I think the government's going too far... |
| Date | 22:15:27, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Prevention is better than cure.. |
| Date | 22:38:07, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | And having to do neither is the cheapest... |
| Date | 23:32:18, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Letting it go to waste? Disgusting! There'll be no Alorians left for the capitalists to exploit if we keep destroying the planet! |
| Date | 23:57:56, January 12, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Lies. Like usual, your statements are not based in fact but in speculation! |
| Date | 00:20:32, January 13, 2006 CET | From | Aloria Green Socialist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | So where's the fact to destroy my point? Answer: there is none! You resort to name-calling! |
| Date | 03:06:56, January 13, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Well, neither of us gives facts and both of us call names (monarchist? fascist?) |
| Date | 04:20:23, January 13, 2006 CET | From | Independent Capitalist Party | To | Debating the ICP's New Positions Bill |
| Message | Whatever happened to not deregulating civil rights, FP? It appears as if you party changes positions yet again. Is that the fourth or fifth tme? You'll never be a major party again if you change positions every other session of the legislature. |
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Voting
| Vote | Seats | |||||||
| yes | Total Seats: 276 | |||||||
| no |
Total Seats: 324 | |||||||
| abstain | Total Seats: 0 |
| Random fact: Any RP law granting extraordinary "emergency powers" or dictator-like powers to a government must be passed by at least a 2/3rds majority, but (like all RP laws) may always be overturned by a simple majority vote of the legislature. |
| Random quote: "Religion, like capitalism, will perish in the end. We estimate the complete Terra-wide extinction of Hosianism as a religious belief by the year 4409, and in Dorvik by 4398." - Friedrich Pfeiffer, former Dorvish politician |